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IVC Filter Penetration (Caval)|IVC Filter Retrieval (Loop-wire Snare)||Male
IVC Filter Penetration (Caval)|IVC Filter Retrieval (Loop-wire Snare)||Male
2016anesthesiaapproachbendingcavacavalcompanioncomplexextravascularfemoralfilterfiltersforcepsfractureguyshookinterventionallaparoscopylooplumenpatientpreparepreparedpullpullingrenalretroperitonealsheathSIRstrutstrutssurgeonssurgicallyvascular
The Set Up of IR in Saudi Arabia | An IR Perspective from Saudi Arabia
The Set Up of IR in Saudi Arabia | An IR Perspective from Saudi Arabia
admissionbattlecarecenterschapterhospitalinpatientinstitutioninterventionalinterventionalistinventorynursespainpatientsprivilegeprocedureradiologysaudisedationservicetertiarytextturfvascular
Aspiration Thrombectomy | Management of Patients with Acute & Chronic PE
Aspiration Thrombectomy | Management of Patients with Acute & Chronic PE
angioAngiodynamicsAngiovac CannulaAspirex CathetercatheterschapterclotdevicedevicesfrenchIndigo ThrombectomyNonepatientPenumbraPenumbra Inc.sheathStraub Medicalthrombectomythrombustpa
CTEPH Studies | Management of Patients with Acute & Chronic PE
CTEPH Studies | Management of Patients with Acute & Chronic PE
acutearterieschapterchroniccpapedemainterdisciplinaryjapanmultidisciplinarymultipleNoneoperatorspatientpatientsperformedpulmonaryreperfusionrequiringthrombolysistreatedtreatmentvascular
Current Status of IR in South Africa | South African Interventional Society (SAintS)
Current Status of IR in South Africa | South African Interventional Society (SAintS)
africacardiologistschapterdiagnosticradiologistradiologistsradiologyspecialtiessurgeonsumbrellavascular
Indirect Angiography | Interventional Oncology
Indirect Angiography | Interventional Oncology
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Theories on Accident Causation | Looking for risk in all the Right Places: The Anatomy of Errors in Healthcare
Theories on Accident Causation | Looking for risk in all the Right Places: The Anatomy of Errors in Healthcare
anatomychapterdefensesfailuresinterventionalmistakesNoneoccurringpatientvisible
The Path Forward | Uterine Artery Embolization The Good, The Bad, The Ugly
The Path Forward | Uterine Artery Embolization The Good, The Bad, The Ugly
chapterembolizationfibroidfibroidsgynecologistgynecologyhysterectomyinterventionalNoneobgynPathophysiologypatientpatientsprocedureproceduresprogramsurgicallyworkup
The Impact of Twitter on Our Specialty | Twitter Case Files: Impact on our specialty and how to expand our reach
The Impact of Twitter on Our Specialty | Twitter Case Files: Impact on our specialty and how to expand our reach
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Treatment Options- CAS- Embolic Protection Device (EPD)- Proximal Protection | Carotid Interventions: CAE, CAS, & TCAR
Treatment Options- CAS- Embolic Protection Device (EPD)- Proximal Protection | Carotid Interventions: CAE, CAS, & TCAR
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Treatment Options- CAS- Embolic Protection Device (EPD)- Distal Protection | Carotid Interventions: CAE, CAS, & TCAR
Treatment Options- CAS- Embolic Protection Device (EPD)- Distal Protection | Carotid Interventions: CAE, CAS, & TCAR
arteriesarteryaspirateballoonbasketbloodbraincapturecarotidcarotid arterycerebralchapterclinicaldebrisdevicedistaldistallyembolicfilterfiltersflowincompleteinternalinternal carotidlesionlesionsoversizeparticlespatientperfectphenomenonplaqueprotectedprotectionproximalsheathstenosisstentstentingstrokestrokesthrombustinyultimatelyvesselwire
Q&A- Procedural Sedation | Procedural Sedation: An Education Review
Q&A- Procedural Sedation | Procedural Sedation: An Education Review
adverseanesthesiaanesthesiologistanesthesiologistsarrhythmiablockscardiacchaptercomfortablediazepamdosingeffectselectiveembolizationfibroidhyperkalemiainstitutionlabsNoneopioidoutcomespatientpatientspeakperioperativepharmacokineticsprocedurepropofolprotocolproviderproviderssedatedsedationserumuterineversed
Treatment Options- Carotid Endarterectomy (CEA) | Carotid Interventions: CAE, CAS, & TCAR
Treatment Options- Carotid Endarterectomy (CEA) | Carotid Interventions: CAE, CAS, & TCAR
anesthesiaanestheticarterycarotidcarotid arterychapterclotcomparingdistallyexternalexternal carotidflowincisioninternalinternal carotidissuelongitudinalloopsmedicalpatientpatientsplaqueproximalstenosisstenoticstentstentingstrokesurgerytherapyultimatelyvascularvesselwound
Practice Guidelines | Procedural Sedation: An Education Review
Practice Guidelines | Procedural Sedation: An Education Review
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PE Management | Management of Patients with Acute & Chronic PE
PE Management | Management of Patients with Acute & Chronic PE
anticoagulationcardiologychapterconsensuscriticaldecisionembolisminstitutioninterventionalmultidisciplinaryNoneoxygenpatientpulmonaryteamteamstelemetrytpatumorvascular
Q&A Uterine Fibroid Embolization | Uterine Artery Embolization The Good, The Bad, The Ugly
Q&A Uterine Fibroid Embolization | Uterine Artery Embolization The Good, The Bad, The Ugly
adjunctiveanesthesiaarteryblockscatheterchapterconceivecontrolembolizationfertilityfibroidfibroidshormoneshydrophilichypogastricimaginginabilitylidocainemultiplenauseanerveNonepainpatchpatientpatientspostpregnantproceduralquestionradialrelaxantsheathshrinksuperior
Introduction to Establishing Periprocedural Screening Guidelines to reduce bleeding risk associated with Image-Guided Theraputic and Diagnostic Procedures | Risk Mitigation: Periprocedural Screening and Anticoagulation Guidelines to Reduce Interventional Radiology Bleeding Risks
Introduction to Establishing Periprocedural Screening Guidelines to reduce bleeding risk associated with Image-Guided Theraputic and Diagnostic Procedures | Risk Mitigation: Periprocedural Screening and Anticoagulation Guidelines to Reduce Interventional Radiology Bleeding Risks
anticoagulantscampuschapterclinicclinicalcoagulationgraduatedguidedguidelineshospitalinpatientinpatientsinterventionallabsmayomedicationsneuroNonenonvascularnursenursingpatientspracticeproceduresradiologistsradiologyrochesterspecialistultrasoundvascular
Q&A Improving Patient Delays | IR Lean Sigma Team Improves Patient Experience and Throughput
Q&A Improving Patient Delays | IR Lean Sigma Team Improves Patient Experience and Throughput
anesthesiabedsidecenterchapterclinicalcoordinatecoordinatordelaysdocumentFellowsfloorguyshopkinshoustoninpatientinpatientsintakejefflabsmanagingmanpowerNonenursenursesoutpatientspackpatientpatientsphasephysicianphysiciansprocedureproceduresradiologyresourcescheduleschedulingsurveystriageturnaround
Breaking Boundaries | #Filterout: Advanced IVC Filter Removal Techniques I Learned from Twitter
Breaking Boundaries | #Filterout: Advanced IVC Filter Removal Techniques I Learned from Twitter
bentchapterdeviceemergingexactfilterlaserlooppenetratedremovedsheathsnaretechnologies
Q&A- Documentation, Before and After results, Leadership, Culture | Innovation and Application of Real Time Nursing Dashboards
Q&A- Documentation, Before and After results, Leadership, Culture | Innovation and Application of Real Time Nursing Dashboards
accomplishchapterculturedatadocumentationdocumentinginterventionalleadershipmanagermodalityNonenursenursesnursingpatientphysiciansprojectprojectsradiologyroundingteamtechnologisttechnologists
Treatment Options- TransCarotid Artery Revascularization- TCAR | Carotid Interventions: CAE, CAS, & TCAR
Treatment Options- TransCarotid Artery Revascularization- TCAR | Carotid Interventions: CAE, CAS, & TCAR
angiographyangioplastyarterybleedbloodcalcifiedcarotidchapterclaviclecommondebrisdevicedistalembolicembolizationexposurefemoralflowimageincisioninstitutionlabeledpatientprocedureprofileproximalreversalreversesheathstenosisstentstentingstepwisesurgicalsuturedsystemultimatelyveinvenousvessel
Renal Ablation | Interventional Oncology
Renal Ablation | Interventional Oncology
ablationcardiomyopathycentimeterchaptereffusionembolizedfamiliallesionmetastaticparenchymalpatientpleuralrenalspleensurgerytolerated
The Disease Process | TIPS & DIPS: State of the Art
The Disease Process | TIPS & DIPS: State of the Art
ascitesbasicallybloodchaptercirculationcirrhosisconnectionsdipsesophagealextrahepaticgastricHypertensionlivermesenteryorganperineumpleuralportalportosystemicpressurerenalshuntshuntsslidesspleenstepsurgicaltampathoraxtipstransplanttransplantationvalvesvaricesvein
Cone Beam CT | Interventional Oncology
Cone Beam CT | Interventional Oncology
ablationanatomicangioarteriesarteryartifactbeamchaptercombconecontrastdoseembolicenhancementenhancesesophagealesophagusgastricgastric arteryglucagonhcchepatectomyinfusinglesionliverlysisoncologypatientsegmentstomach
Introduction to Respiratory Compromise | Respiratory Compromise: Use of Capnography During Procedural Sedation
Introduction to Respiratory Compromise | Respiratory Compromise: Use of Capnography During Procedural Sedation
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Case- May Thurner Syndrome | Pelvic Congestion Syndrome
Case- May Thurner Syndrome | Pelvic Congestion Syndrome
arterycatheterizecausingchapterclassiccliniccommoncommon iliaccompressioncongestionendovascularevidenceextremitygonadalhugeiliaciliac veinimagingincompetenceincompetentMay Thurner Syndromeobstructionoccludedpelvicpressuresecondarystentsymptomstreatmentsvalvularvaricositiesvaricosityveinveinsvenavenous
UFE and Adenomyosis | Uterine Artery Embolization The Good, The Bad, The Ugly
UFE and Adenomyosis | Uterine Artery Embolization The Good, The Bad, The Ugly
accessadenomyosisarteryaxisbifurcationcardiaccathetercatheterschaptercharacteristiccomplicationsdiameterdimeembolizationfemoralfibroidfibroidshematomahydrophiliclabsNonepatientspracticeradialsheathulnaruterine
Scope of IR Procedures in South Africa | South African Interventional Society (SAintS)
Scope of IR Procedures in South Africa | South African Interventional Society (SAintS)
biliarycardiologistscenterschapterinterventionalInterventionsneuroparacentesisproceduressurgeonsvascular
Benefits of UFE | Uterine Artery Embolization The Good, The Bad, The Ugly
Benefits of UFE | Uterine Artery Embolization The Good, The Bad, The Ugly
arterycenterschapterembolizationfibroidgooglegynecologistgynecologistsgynecologyhysterectomieshysterectomyinterventionalMRINonepainfulpatientsprocedureproceduresseansmartersurgeryuterine
Pre-procedure Assessment | Procedural Sedation: An Education Review
Pre-procedure Assessment | Procedural Sedation: An Education Review
abnormalitiesadverseairwayanesthesiaanesthesiologistapneaauscultationcervicalchaptercomorbiditiescopddiseaseedemaejectionfractionhabitushemodynamicallylitersmedicationsneckneurologicNonepatientpatientsphysiologicproceduralpulmonaryrenalsedationsleepslidesspinestatus
Case 1 - Non-healing heel wound, Rutherford Cat. 5, previous stroke | Recanalization, Atherectomy | Complex Above Knee Cases with Re-entry Devices and Techniques
Case 1 - Non-healing heel wound, Rutherford Cat. 5, previous stroke | Recanalization, Atherectomy | Complex Above Knee Cases with Re-entry Devices and Techniques
abnormalangioangioplastyarteryAsahiaspectBARDBoston Scientificcatheterchaptercommoncommon femoralcontralateralcritical limb ischemiacrossCROSSER CTO recanalization catheterCSICTO wiresdevicediseasedoppleressentiallyfemoralflowglidewiregramhawk oneHawkoneheeliliacimagingkneelateralleftluminalMedtronicmicromonophasicmultimultiphasicocclusionocclusionsoriginpatientsplaqueposteriorproximalpulserecanalizationrestoredtandemtibialtypicallyViance crossing catheterVictory™ Guidewirewaveformswirewireswoundwounds
Transcript

>> So in our next case it's a lateral cavagram and as you can see the hook is completely extracaval. How many of you have seen something like this? [BLANK_AUDIO]

Anybody wanna volunteer as to how they would approach this case? Didn't think so. >> Refer to you. >> [LAUGH]

How would you guys approach this? >> It's interesting the physician at the back has used femoral approach for filters in general. Is this one you've tried femoral approach on it, would it work in that situation?

>> [INAUDIBLE] [LAUGH] >> And actually bringing up femoral approach and forceps, has anybody noticed an issue with using forceps through the pelvis?

I've noticed that patients that are not under monitored anesthesia care meaning propofol or something else can have significant pain. [INAUDIBLE] >> [INAUDIBLE]How many ever involving anesthesia for your complex retrievals? >> Interesting. We typically use modern sedation.

When we first started with the laser for logistic reasons and we were doing them in the OR because we didn't have the appropriate power outlet in interventional radiology. We were using anesthesia and we found it to be cumbersome etc. So now that we do these interventional radiology we have done mostly our own sedation but it seems that some of these complex cases

involving forceps particularly if you're gonna put larger angles on the rigid forceps it seems like it's uncomfortable for patients. And we've talked about maybe going to a MAC anesthesia for some of those patients for that reason [BLANK_AUDIO] >> So we approached

this case by forming, well we tried multiple things but the thing that ended up working in this case, and I'll show you a companion case in a second was a loop wire around the neck as a filter. As you can see several of the struts are displaced.

I think what's critical here is a big sheath. This is a 20 French sheath and the idea here was that we were looking to withdraw the filter hook back into the caval lumen. Now of course bloody horror story pictures go through your head as to what could happen when you do something like that so that brings up the question, how many of you prepare for caval injury

and how do you prepare for that? Do you prepare with a balloon? And what kind of balloons do you guys use? Does anybody use an aortic occlusion balloon [BLANK_AUDIO]. >> So Coda's a great balloon for this. So I got a question for you Kush cuz this picture just sends shivers

up my spine. You're pulling this hook that presumably is extravascular on a CT Scan? >> Correct, actually on a cavagram too, but yes. >> So how do you know you're not grabbing something else with that

hook that is extravascular and you are yanking it into the vascular space? >> So retroperitoneal nerves, etc. >> Well yeah, sure. There's a lot of living tissue in there that doesn't belong in

the vascular lumen >> Well so I can say that the wire itself is on the filter. I guess the question is really is the hook associated with anything else? Is the hook associated with the retroperitoneal vascular structure,

is it associated with nerves or anything else in the retroperineum? I simply don't know. I don't think there's any way to know for sure unless symptomatically, but as we pointed out we had anesthesia involved in this case so you may not know. Certainly prepared for the contingencies.

In this case everything went fine and we were able to pull through it. I'm gonna show you the companion case. >> One second, go back. >> No, and

It's the same case. >> Well I think there are a couple of interesting things to discuss. Number one, we go back even a slide, we recognize. So Kush and I worked together and Bob used to work with us, but we end up often getting into a point of no return with these filters.

So I think there's a decision to be made as to whether or not you're really gonna go for it or not. And if you go back, here you're already seeing that we could still leave this filter, but we're gonna leave it in a worse place than when we started. And I tend to not like to,

once you've already gone down this road now you're really working to get it out because you've done that. So I think when you tackle these cases, you maybe potentially have cross section, but you're ahead of time or you get in there. I always think that there are some definitive maneuvers that when

you do you know you're stuck with trying to remove it at this point and you have to be prepared for that. And part of that being prepared may be in prepared if you have a complication. So you just have to take that, or worst case scenarios you have to think of. >>

Yes sir. >> I know it may be theoretical idea but maybe [INAUDIBLE] That may be quicker, safer thing to do. >> That's not unreasonable. And so I think that that raises a very interesting point. Let's say this is your end image. You go in after this and you can't quite get the hook back in the

lumen. You've been at it for, let's say three or four hour now, and you're making zero headway. You're not getting this filter today. And this is kinda what Bob was alluding to, the point of no return. So your filter, let's just take that sheath out of the picture and

the looped wire. Now you've got a select filter that's pretty much mangled you've undoubtedly kinked at least a couple of the struts, what do you do now? How would you manage this patient at this point?

Let me ask a simple question who would put this patient on anticoagulation? Asprin, Coumadin? Who would put this patient on Coumadin at this point? Lovenox? Asprin? Yeah I don't know, I would be a little nervous here that this patient

could definitely thrombose given the fact you've really made flow turbulent through this area now. What would you do? Would you refer this patient to a vascular surgeon? All in favor say aye or raise your hand? Okay.

Yes sir. >> [INAUDIBLE] >> Interesting. In case you guys didn't hear that, this gentleman was referring to an identical case where they tried to get the hook back in and as soon as they did it,

the cava ruptured. The patient expired and obviously there were attempts to try and control the hemorrhage. >> [INAUDIBLE] >> So do you think it was a caval rupture that killed the patient or could it have been that the hook ruptured an artery and

the patient died of arterial hemorrhage. >> [INAUDIBLE] >> Oh I see- >> A longitudinal. >> Okay, a longitudinal rapture of the IVC. >> [INAUDIBLE]

>> Interesting. >> [INAUDIBLE] >> Yes sir. >> In a similar situation what happened [INAUDIBLE] pull it out of the [INAUDIBLE] >> So the hook stayed extravascular and you started to pull the filter up.

So it's kind of like ragdoll, as some people described it, kind of bending the filter in half. So did you have it by forceps? >> No I didn't have forceps. >> So you just had it wired through it.

Interesting. >> I think we had this much of the filter [INAUDIBLE] to the hook, this much of the apex. I wouldn't do an endovascular surgically [INAUDIBLE] just LiNA laparoscopy because the access route is really easy. >> Interesting. Yes sir.

>> [INAUDIBLE] >> Fair question. >> It's a great question. >> Would anybody stent here? >> I think one of the challenges potentially is that it's at the level of the renal vein. I guess we didn't see where the renal vein come in here,

but there may be some technical issues with that. Howie, you had a comment? >> I had a question actually. The gentleman who mentioned laparoscopy. Are you not going to have the same issue pulling the filter from outside through the wall of the cava and cause a rupture.

>> No, cuz you're pulling the stress with your low profile. That big complex at the top is a weapon if you pull it back in. >> Do you have you experience with that? >> Experienced other things with laparoscopy but not this. [INAUDIBLE]

>> Certainly it's worth having dialogue with your vascular surgeons. We have at certain times with some other cases not necessarily this one and they are fairly reluctant at our institution to be involved with filter retrieval. Have commented that it's actually a fairly large operations.

They have not suggested that they would do it laparoscopically. Actually our vascular surgeons who are are very aggressive endovascularly. But it's certainly worth having dialogue. And maybe let's say maybe there's other types of surgeons at the hospital rather than vascular surgeons but I'm certain the vascular surgeons would be involved at some level.

Yes Sir. >> [INAUDIBLE] [INAUDIBLE] >> Well other than the risk of thrombosis what about the risk of fracture? Now that hose filter elements have been displaced was anybody worried about component fracture?

>> [INAUDIBLE] >> Before you get to the point of no return is what you're saying? >> [INAUDIBLE] >> Again not to flog a dead horse here but I think if you are taking out a filter and you inadvertently bend a strut and you can't get the filter out,

I think you're absolutely obligated to that patient to refer them either to another place to try retrieval, or to a vascular surgeon who might be able to manage it surgically or laproscopically as the case may be. But I feel very

strongly that once you mangle a filter, you've gone that far, you cannot let it go. You just can't do that. I feel very strongly about this and I'm sure all of you have seen filters come through where somebody maybe,

they mean well but they bend a strut and then it becomes a real problem for that patient. This will fracture undoubtedly, these struts will fracture 100 percent, when they're bent up like that. Remember how dynamic the cava is the whole time, it is pushing, it is pulling, it is torsional.

There are so many forces is at hand, these will fracture. >> Just to finish up this case is from a similar case, this is what we ended up doing in the first case, which is withdrawing the filter apex by applying traction on the loop bar or in the other case

forceps against the the tip of the sheath. In this case I believe this was a 16 French sheath, and then bending it back and then bending it back in the lumen in the cavagram was clean afterwards. [BLANK_AUDIO].

doing in the US so the setup usually in the hospital you have an angio suite recovery procedure rooms usually a new suite is like you know the you know like

what's in the market like top-notch or good things things especially if you're in a government hospital and then you have a storage you have vascular and Vascular now the scope is different some people just do vascular procedures some

people do everything at our institution we do everything that has a needle that you know you have to deal with it I are an interventional neuroradiology as well we integrate integrated actually we're one team and most of the inner

interventionalist and in Saudi Arabia are actually near radiologists or near interventionalist neural interventional radiology but we have like few comers who are neurologist or neurosurgeons so the team is like text nurses residents

fellows attendings but we don't have pas in Saudi Arabia which is a great privilege here and in the u.s. now text they don't scrub in as in the u.s. few of them they do but mostly nurses now nurses they do recovery patient care and

and so on and so forth just like here but the the privilege of PA is not there the workflow itself so it's institution dependent you do like we have rounds in the morning we do also flow rounds we have consultation service we have

clinics we have also like admission to day care radiology day care or like the day care but we still kind of like struggling with the inpatient admission which is I think the status here here you

the privilege also having a hospitalist at some hospitals you have a deal with the interventionalist who can admit under the hospitalist or sometimes under special services now sedation is also like you take it for granted there you

can have to fight for it so we do sedation's but not every institution like moderate sedation and then you have your own scheduled inpatient outpatient the scope of service also depends on this institution but basically we do a

very wide spectrum we do really advanced cases actually back home and we're very proud of what we do to be honest planning is very important because you don't always have the material that you want so it's very important to have good

planning to request a call and get materials you want to establish new service like when we come back like a few a lot of people actually trained in the US Canada and and so on and so forth Europe and they come back and they're

gonna start services so you always establish new service you have to write protocols and things like that you have didactics M&M and so on and so forth there are so many cases that we do as we said but you know again like

sometimes beyond the fellowship beyond the training you have to start new stuff you know you can like a tracheal stenting esophageal standing PD catheter with a Dean you know get that training in the US when I was here but now it's

like something common so you know things like that you have both of disciplinary conferences or meetings we have HCC liver tumor board GI conference you know vascular access conference which is kicked off and it's one of the good

things referral it's actually kind of aromatic so because I work for example in my institution it's a tertiary care hospital it's Oncology Center so it's automatically whenever a patient is

diagnosed with anything they can get actually referred so you have kind of from primary to secondary to tertiary care they just say it goes directly now you have direct referrals also like from diabetic foot centers dialysis centers

and also those patients can come in the nice thing is IR is kind of independent so we can accept patients just to all four IR so they come in for biopsy they come in for a procedure for a drainage for Anna Frost in exchange for whatever

and they leave the hospital so sometimes they come with an ambulance if they are not walkie-talkie they come with an ambulance we do the procedure they go back to their home institution and they we cover actually an area that is more

than 400 to 500 miles radius so some of them actually they're so sick to the point that they need to be transferred completely for CAIR turf battle is like it's not as the u.s. because the government sector as I

said it's the biggest thing so there's no incentive to do more it's basically like you want to do more because you want to help patients so the turf battle is not the same but it's still there you know just kind of personality things so

we still kind of like you know have peripheral arterial disease AV fistula we have kind of like some turf battle with vascular very cozy land and prostate in bolas ation sometimes you're all just won't kind of refer or won't

tell patients that these things exist with gynecology you have good relations but that sometimes that can happen that they want to do myomectomy or something I'm not your inorder embolization so pain we actually established a very

strong pain service right now and we do so many injections and things like that so they actually despise surgeons who refer to us on the arthropods they really like our results and the patients are happy so they started referring more

and more patients which kind of tip you know ruffle some feathers on the pain service admission as I said you know hospital service but we still don't have admission so inventory you have to know everything

I got like all the list from here before I left because you know the text or the there's no like specialized person to kind of handle inventory we have someone assigned but they're not as you know versatile with that so we have to kind

of like you know you have to know what you have you have to sometimes you're in procedure you have to say like no I know that in that corner that is that piece so please bring that on and you know the nice thing about their you know there's

support from companies not every company as in the u.s. is exist in there but you have good support you have the privilege of having some seee mark stuff which comes from Europe they're not FDA approved but they're seee mark approved

so you can actually get the European stuff before you give them in the US so

thrombectomy is another popular way of treating patients there's a lot of different aspiration catheters the SPX catheter is actually not available currently in the US but what it basically is I can have the rectum a

device that spins in such backlot the Indigo thrombectomy system from penumbra is a yet another device that sucks out clot I think many of us have used that it's kind of like a vacuum cleaner but usually more like a dust

hand vac where it's going to suck up thrombus the angio vac is much more like a Hoover where you're going to use and put a patient on veno-venous bypass that requires a 22 French sheath and a 17 French sheath but that will take out

thrombus I personally prefer using NGO vac in the IVC in big large thrombus for that and not in the pulmonary arteries because it's very inflexible but it's very very useful in a few patient populations in

all of these devices there is no TPA that needs to be given you're just sucking out the clot and you're actually removing it from the patient's body rather than dissolving it and sending it downstream the drawbacks on all of these

devices is their larger access points the SP or X is around six French although that's not that much bigger penumbra device is 8 French and the as we mentioned the angio vac is 22 French

that was one example so these are there have a lot of potential complications reperfusion pulmonary edema is a very very big potential complication so you could get through the case patient does

great you open up multiple pulmonary arteries and then they start coughing up blood and then they end up started drowning in their own blood and the ICU so we do not want to push that and the initial papers that you can see down

below on that table they had a very high almost 10% in some cases pulmonary edema requiring treatment requiring patients being put on CPAP or being intubated and that is because they treated too much at one time

and so now as this when this first started in the early 2000s the operators were treating multiple segments at multiple times at one time and they were using large balloons and we figured out that that was what was killing patients

and so we changed our treatment so this is the first study that was ever performed for this it was performed by dr. Feinstein I believe this was published in circulation it was done in Harvard at MGH they had 18 patients with

36 month follow-up they all improved in their ability to walk as well as their lifestyle but many of them 11 out of 18 patients had reperfusion injury so this was the first paper and at that time it became the last paper because so many

patients did poorly but here's what they're sort of what they did and the ones that did okay they you could see that they had an improvement in the New York Heart Association classification again that just means they can walk

further they're not less short of breath and that they could walk further in 6 minutes which is again our sort of first test outcomes over time whence this has become increased so you can see that study was in 2001 and then

it kind of went away for a long time and it came back in 2012 in Japan where the most operators are there they've treated up to 255 procedures now since this slide was made we're up to a thousand in Japan and those patients are doing very

well but you'll notice that they have multiple procedures so again you don't try to one-and-done these patients they come back four to six times we've treated a couple patients where I work and we've treated that was patients four

times already and so they do much better but it's a slow slow and steady treatment so I want to wrap up with saying that the IR team is very critical to patients who are getting treated for PE we're involved in the diagnosis as

the radiology team acute and chronic PE it's very important to know as I've shown you in some of the examples and some of the images which when it's acute and versus chronic doing thrombolysis on a patient with chronic PE is useless all

you're doing is putting them at a risk you're not going to be able to break up that clot it's very important to have inter and multidisciplinary approach to patient care so interdisciplinary meaning everybody in this room nurses

technologists and physicians working together to take care of that patient that's on your table right now and multi-disciplinary because you have to work with cardiology vascular medicine the ICU teams and the

referring providers whether it's neurosurgery vascular surgery whomever it is who's Evers patient gets a PE you have to work together and it's very important again to have collaborative care in these patients if we're doing a

procedure and somebody notices that the patient is desaturating that's very very important when you're working in the pulmonary arteries if somebody notices that the patient's groin is bleeding you have to speak up so it's very important

that everybody is working together which is really what we need to do for these patients so there's my references and there's my kid so thank you guys very much hopefully this was helpful I'd be

country of 50 just under 58 million population we've got only 650

radiologists I wish one day those who all the IRS and most of the radiologists and the private sector and about 20% of them do IR work in South Africa dr and i are all under one umbrella in fact asses IRS who we are subsidiaries of this big

umbrella of diagnostic radiology we all belong to one register and IRS not yet recognized as an independent entity as an example when we run radiology meetings such as this to be predominantly diagnostic work and

there's a little half session maybe of IR some way so IRS basically done by diagnostic radiologist were interested in IR and over the years we I or is started to pick up in popularity there are other non radiology specialties

we've now started doing IR procedures a case in point vascular surgeons like dr. side mentioned we don't have a formal training program in the country yet something that working hard on with the support of

societies like si R we hope to be setting something announced with international support and accreditation so most of the people who are doing IR in South Africa are diagnosticians we are self trained as in they would have

gone and the apprentices of experts across the world for specific procedures and then come back and perform those cardiologists and vascular surgeons have basically taken over the peripheral vascular work and I ought to work I

don't particularly miss it because I would learn enough other stuff to look after our society was established is

to talk about is indirect angiography this is kind of a neat trick to suggest to your intervention list as a problem solver we were asked to ablate this lesion and it looked kind of funny this patient had a resection for HCC they

thought this was a recurrence so we bring the comb beam CT and we do an angio and it doesn't enhance so this is an image here of indirect port ography so what you can do is an SMA run and see at which point along the

run do you pacify the portal vein and you just set up your cone beam CT for that time so you just repeat your injection and now your pacifying the entire portal vein even though you haven't selected it and what to show

well this was a portal aneurysm after resection with a little bit of clot in it the patient went on some aspirin and it resolved in three months so back to our first patient what do you do for someone who has HCC that's invading the

heart this patient underwent 2y 90s bland embolization microwave ablation chemotherapy and SBRT and he's an eight-year survivor so it's one of those things where certainly with the correct patient selection you can find the right

things to do for someone I think that usually our best results come from our interdisciplinary consensus in terms of trying to use the unique advantages that individual therapies have and IO is just one of those but this is an important

lesson to our whole group that you know a lot of times you get your best results when you use things like a team approach so in summary there are applications to IO prior to surgery to make people surgical candidates there are definitive

treatments ie your cancer will be treated definitively with curative intent a lot of times we can save when people have tried cure intent and weren't able to and obviously to palliate folks to try to buy them time

and quality of life thermal ablation is safe and effective for small lesions but it's limited by the adjacent anatomy y9t is not an ischemic therapy it's an ablative therapy you're putting small ablative radioactive particles within

the lesion and just using the blood supply as a conduit for your brachytherapy and you can use this as a new admin application to make people safer surgical candidates when you apply to the entire ride a panic globe

thanks everyone appreciate it [Applause] [Music]

riesen comes to us and he talks about

some theories on why we make mistakes so and we're gonna cover these and then we're gonna cover the Swiss cheese model which many of you may be aware of so sorry slips tend to hurt current situations that are so routine that

they've become rote so an example of a slip could be selecting the wrong drug from a drop-down alright so again slips and lapses occur when the correct plan is made but executed incorrectly so we have that drop down of drugs but we just

select the wrong one that's a slip a lapse is generally not visible because it's reflective of a memory failure so for instance we may have a patient who forgets to take their medications or we may have a prescriber that forgets to

take a drug off of a med rec so those are examples of slips or lapses mistakes or judgment failures they're more subtle and they're complex than slips and these can go undetected for a period of time and they're often left to

a difference of opinion well I don't do it the same way that Mary does it who doesn't do it the same way that sue does it so those are mistakes and their knowledge base we know the right thing to do but because we have outside things

that are occurring situations that are occurring we may have to do some workarounds and those workarounds aren't always safe or we're gonna get in and this is part of the anatomy we're gonna get into the anatomy a little bit later

and often mistakes are rule-based so we know the rules we know what we're supposed to do but for factors that are out of our control we bypass those and that's when mistakes can happen active failure failures are highly visible

errors and we usually see these because they have immediate consequences and then the latent failures their processes that are under the radar they come from not following policies and there may be a good reason why we're not following

policies but oftentimes we hear that we've always done it that way and that means they're rooted in culture so that's where the justa culture comes into play all right Swiss cheese model so this is this is probably a graphic

that's very familiar to a lot of people but it does really it's it's at the basis of a patient safety air so organizations have defenses those are the slices of cheese now those defenses although we'd like them to be solid

they're oftentimes not they're filled with holes because of human factors the human condition those active and latent failures the slips lapses and mistakes that happen to all of us it's a part of us so often some of those defenses get

penetrated but then there's another defense that stops let's take for example identifying a patient so a patient comes in and maybe they're not english-speaking they may be

spanish-speaking and so we call their name and they answer the answer yes because it's close enough right it's close just close enough and they come up we don't check anything we don't check don't verify their name and their date

of birth we pass them on to our prep recovery room and then we're getting them ready because we have confidence that Jane at our front desk she doesn't make an error she always identifies the right patient so we have a high level of

confidence in Jane it's not a bad thing that's an OK Fay but here again we're not doing what we know is in our policy so it's rule-based and that we know is the right thing to do so it's knowledge base so it becomes a

mistake that we're not checking our patients identity and date of birth and that patient gets back to let's say the interventional room and boom we stop because now we're doing a timeout and we identify that we have the wrong patient

for our procedure and it stops but sometimes these heirs line up the holes line up and it's just one of those days and we end up with a patient safety event at the end so now we come to the

patient who did not come from the street so if you've been here for a few years

you've heard me talk about you know some of my friends this is also one of my other friends who has large fibroids but her fibroids were so big and they were not all very vascular and so I sent her to have surgery and she ended up having

a hysterectomy with removal of her cervix because of abnormal pap smears but her ovaries were left in place so our path forward after doing this procedure from 1995 a procedure that is not experimental a procedure that has

had a lot a lot of research done on it more research than most procedures that are done surgically or by interventional radiologists I'd say that it would require a partnership it is true that we can see patients on our own and we can

manage mostly everything but at the end of the day uterine artery embolization is still a palliative procedure because we don't know what causes fibroids to begin with and as long as the uterus is still there there's always a chance that

new fibroids will come back so in your practice and in mind I believe that a path forward is a sustaining program embolization program which is built on a relationship with the gynecologist that yes

I am as aggressive as any other interventionist that is out there but if this were my mom and that is my usual test for things I would say that where we would like to position ourselves is in the business of informing the

patient's as much as possible so that they can make an informed decision and that we're asking our gynecology partners to do the same is that if you're going to have a hysterectomy for a benign disease that you should demand

and we as a society and you as your sisters keeper should be asking for why am I not eligible for an embolization so si R is actually embarking on a major campaign in the next year or so it's called the vision to heal campaign and

it's all around providing education for this disease stage what I like to tell our patients and I'm almost finished here is when I talk to our gynecologist and to techs and nurses as well I said woody woody what should I expect right

that's what they want to know when I send my patient to you what should I expect and I say that what you should expect that Shawn and myself we're gonna tell the patient everything about fibroids we're gonna talk to them about

what the fibroids are the pathophysiology of it the same things I told you we're gonna tell them about the procedures that treat it we tell them about the options to do nothing we talk about all of the risk and the benefits

of the procedures especially of fibroid embolization and we start the workup to see if they're an appropriate candidate when they're an appropriate candidate we communicate with them and their OBGYN and then we schedule them for their

procedure in our practice there are a few of us who send our patients home on the same day and we let our patients know no one is kicking you out of the hospital if you can't go home that day then you'll get to stay but

most of our patients are able to go home that day and then we see our patients back in clinic somewhere between two and four months three months and six months and we own that patient follow-up their visits and after their year we have them

follow back up with their gynecologist and so that we're managing all of these sites and it comes back to that new again may not be so new for some of the people that have been doing clinical IR four years that shift that we own these

patients if you're a nurse in this room these are our patients these questions need to be answered by us in our department we do not believe that these patients should be calling their gynecologist for the answers to that

like what should I be doing right now should I be taking I haven't had a bowel movement and like that is something that we answer we're the ones that are given them the discharge instructions and we set them back up for their follow-up so

hi everyone I'm so excited to be here my name's Michelle mana B's I am a UT Houston fourth-year resident and I'll be headed to Yale for AI our fellowship in the fall and I'm happy to start us off this afternoon with the impact of Twitter on our specialty in how we can

expand our reach and so just a little bit about the platform that we've all chosen Twitter's a micro blog 280 characters for fewer images and short-form videos what this says to me is this is perfectly tailored for our

fast-paced highlights only major learning point objective when sharing about our favorite subject and just to give a little bit of perspective in 2018 206 users had hashtag irad in their bio so they were irad users right and March

of just this year we have over 1400 a few more stats for you so these are from just last week so a total of seven days we have 500 total tweets with hashtag irad and as we are an image-based specialty obviously the text with the

tweets with just attacks are not very many and but what I wanted to point out I'm really proud of there are 78 original contributors and 71 percent of those tweets were retweets so there's 78 people putting the

information out there and the rest of us are doing a really good job supporting them so what is Twitter done for our specialty three major points networking education awareness and collaboration so I'm a little more familiar with

Instagram so I have over a hundred twenty thousand followers on Instagram and so so this is not as familiar to me right and when I joined Twitter last year sar I had one follower and it was my mom and

I so I posted this on my Instagram I said I just have one Twitter follower what could I do help right and just over a year here we are the most recent stats of my page had significantly grown and that just speaks volumes on how much

we've grown together expanded growing evolved as a community and a presence on social media and I have 964 friends now if you're not friends with me let's be friends right now

oh and so next education and awareness so this page the interventional initiative if you are not following I suggest highly suggest you look into it so this is a nonprofit organization that increases awareness for minimally

invasive procedures their graphics are really patient friendly really easy to understand and this is the first thing you see when you go onto their website so if a patient were to just go on and say why how'd you know something my

doctor said something's wrong with my lungs is there a minimally invasive procedure for that most likely yes and all they have to do is just tap on the organ system that they identify with and they have an easy explanation of the

procedure that they're about to get or a procedure that they might be interested in and a finally collaboration and one of my favorite hashtags that really exemplifies this is hashtag leave your specials here at the door and I met dr.

Sabet I set this year and it unites as more as a disciplinary multidisciplinary group more than just this is my patient it is all of our patient and how can we work together to make sure that our patients have the best outcome and so we

are identifying more as patient centered and not specialty Center and so this is a really good positive aspect of collaboration between specialties and another aspect that I really love collaboration in a way that we get to

break down boundaries geographic boundaries right meet people that we necessary wouldn't get to meet be friends with people we wouldn't be friends with other Hawaiians and have a little fun do we have audio for this oh

darn well pretend Full House is playing in the back and we're are gonna we're gonna watch the whole thing it's so much cooler with the south kid so just you know bringing some fun you are especially doesn't always have

to be cases and always have to be serious and to show that we're humans too and so finally I want to speak a

of these issues filters are generally still use or were used up until a few years ago or five years ago almost exclusively and then between five years and a decade ago there was this new concept of proximal protection or flow

reversal that came about and so this is the scenario where you don't actually cross the lesion but you place a couple balloons one in the external carotid artery one in the common carotid artery and you stop any blood flow that's going

through the internal carotid artery overall so if there's no blood flowing up there then when you cross the lesion without any blood flow there's nothing nowhere for it to go the debris that that is and then you can angioplasty and

or stent and then ultimately place your stent and then get out and then aspirate all of that column of stagnant blood before you deflate the balloons and take your device out so step-by-step I'll walk through this a couple times because

it's a little confusing at least it was for me the first time I was doing this but common carotid artery clamping just like they do in surgery right I showed you the pictures of the surgical into our directa me they do the vessel loops

around the common carotid approximately the eca and the ICA and then actually of clamping each of those sites before they open up the vessel and then they in a sequential organized reproducible manner uncle Dee clamp or unclamp each of those

sites in the reverse order similar to this balloon this is an endovascular clamping if you will so you place this common carotid balloon that's that bottom circle there you inflate you you have that clamping that occurs right

so what happens then is that you've taken off the antegrade blood flow in that common carotid artery on that side you have retrograde blood flow that's coming through from the controller circulation and you have reverse blood

flow from the ECA the external carotid artery from the contralateral side that can retrograde fill the distal common carotid stump and go up the ica ultimately then you can suspend the antegrade blood flow up the common

carotid artery as I said and then you clamp or balloon occlude the external carotid artery so now if you include the external carotid artery that second circle now you have this dark red column of blood up the distal common carotid

artery all the way up the internal carotid artery up until you get the Circle of Willis Circle of Willis allows cross filling a blood on the contralateral side so the patient doesn't undergo stroke because they've

got an intact circulation and they're able to tolerate this for a period of time now you can generally do these with patients awake and assess their ability to tolerate this if they don't tolerate this because of incomplete circle or

incomplete circulation intracranial injury really well then you can you can actually condition the patient to tolerate this or do this fairly quickly because once the balloons are inflated you can move fairly quickly and be done

or do this in stepwise fashion if you do this in combination with two balloons up you have this cessation of blood flow in in the internal carotid artery you do your angioplasty or stenting and post angioplasty if need be and then you

aspirate your your sheath that whole stagnant column of blood you aspirate that with 320 CC syringes so all that blood that's in there and you can check out what you see in the filter but after that point you've taken all that blood

that was sitting there stagnant and then you deflate the balloons you deflate them in stepwise order so this is what happens you get your o 35 stiff wire up into the external carotid artery once it's in the external cart or you do not

want to engage with the lesion itself you take your diagnostic catheter up into the external carotid artery once you're up there you take your stiff wire right so an amp lats wire placed somewhere in the distal external carotid

artery once that's in there you get your sheath in place and then you get your moment devices a nine French device overall and it has to come up and place this with two markers the proximal or sorry that distal markers in the

proximal external carotid artery that's what this picture shows here the proximal markers in the common carotid artery so there's nothing that's touched that lesion so far in any of the images that I've shown and then that's the moma

device that's one of these particular devices that does proximal protection and and from there you inflate the balloon in the external carotid artery you do a little angiographic test to make sure that there's no branch

proximal branch vessels of the external carotid artery that are filling that balloon is inflated now in this picture once you've done that you can inflate the common carotid artery once you've done that now you can take an O on four

wire of your choice cross the lesion because there's no blood flow going so even if you liberated plaque or debris it's not going to go anywhere it's just gonna sit there stagnant and then with that cross do angioplasty this is what

it looks like in real life you have a balloon approximately you have a balloon distally contrast has been injected it's just sitting there stagnant because there's nowhere for it to go okay once the balloons are inflated you've

temporarily suspends this suspended any blood flow within this vasculature and then as long as you confirm that there's no blood flow then you go ahead and proceed with the intervention you can actually check pressures we do a lot of

pressure side sheath pressure measurements the first part of this is what the aortic pressure and common carotid artery pressures are from our sheath then we've inflated our balloons and the fact that there's even any

waveform is actually representative of the back pressure we're getting and there's actually no more antegrade flow in the common carotid artery once you've put this in position then you can stent this once the stent is in place and you

think you like everything you can post dilated and then once you've post dilated then you deflate your balloon right so you deflate your all this debris that's shown in this third picture is sitting there stagnant

you deflate the external carotid artery balloon first and then your common carotid artery and prior to deflating either the balloons you've aspirated the blood flow 320 CC syringes as I said we filter the contents of the third syringe

to see if there's any debris if there's debris and that third filter and that third syringe that we actually continue to ask for eight more until we have a clean syringe but there's no filter debris out because

that might tell us that there's a lot of debris in this particular column of blood because we don't want to liberate any of that so when do you not want to use this well what if the disease that you're dealing with extends past the

common carotid past the internal carotid into the common carotid this device has to pass through that lesion before it gets into the external carotid artery so this isn't a good device for that or if that eca is occluded so you can't park

that kampf balloon that distal balloon to balloon sheath distally into the external carotid artery so that might not be good either if the patient can't tolerate it as I mentioned that's something that we assess for and you

want to have someone who's got some experience with this is a case that it takes a quite a bit of kind of movement and coordination with with the physician technologists or and co-operators that

kind of the embolic protection because I think with carotid artery stenting the stents there's a lot of different types they're all self expanding for the most

part and there's not a lot to talk about there but there is with regards to embolic protection and there so there's distal and violent protection where you have this where that blue little sheath in the common carotid artery you got a

wire through the ica stenosis and a little basket or filter distally before you put the stent in early on they used to think oh maybe we'll do distal balloon occlusion put a balloon up distally do your intervention aspirate

whatever collects behind the balloon and then take the balloon down not so ideal because you never really asked for it a hundred percent of the debris and then whatever whenever you deflate the balloon it goes back it goes up to the

brain you still have some embolic phenomenon in the cerebral vascular churn and then there's this newer concept of proximal protection where you use either flow reversal reverse the blood flow in the cerebral circulation

or you actually cause a stagnant column of blood in the ica so you can't get you don't get anything that embolize is up distally but you have this stagnant column the debris collects there you aspirate that actively before you take

down the balloons that are in position in the X carotids and common carotid artery and then you take everything out so let's walk through each of these if you really wanted to pick out the perfect embolic

protection device it's got to be relatively easy to use it's got to be stable in position so it's not moving up and down and causing injury to the vessel but even while it's in place cerebral perfusion is maintained so that

balloon the distal balloon not a great idea because you're cutting off all the blood flow to the brain you might stop something from embolizing up distally but in the process of doing that you may patient may not tolerate that you want

complete protection during all aspects of the procedure so when we place a filter as you'll see just crossing the lesion with the initial filter can cause a distal embolus so that's a problem you want to be able to use your guide wire

choice as many of you know when we go through peripheral vasculature there's your go-to wires but it doesn't always work every time with that one go-to wire so you want to be able to pick the wire that you want to use or

change it up if needed for different lesions so if you get to use your wire of choice then then that's gonna be a better system than something that's man deter and then if you have a hard time using that wire to get across the lesion

you have a problem overall and then ultimately where do you land that protection device and a few diagrams here to help illustrate this generally speaking these distal embolic protection these filters that go beyond

the lesion have been used for quite a while and are relatively safe you can see them pretty easily and geographically they have little markers on them that signify if they're open or closed and we look for that overall and

blood flows through them it's just a little sieve a little basket that collects really tiny particles micrometers in size but allows blood flow to pass through it so you're not actually causing any cessation of blood

flow to the brain but you are protecting yourself from that embolic debris and it's generally well tolerated overall we had really good results in fact when not using this device there's a lot of strokes that were occurring in use of

this device dramatic reduction so a significant improvement in this procedural area by utilization of embolic protection however distal embolic protection or filter devices are not a perfect APD as you as you may know

those of you have been involved in carotid stenting there is no cerebral protection when you cross the lesion if you have a curlicue internal carotid artery this filter doesn't sit right and and ultimately may not cause

good protection or actually capture everything that breaks off the plaque and it can be difficult to deliver in those really tortuous internal carotid arteries so ultimately you can cross the lesion but you may not get this filter

up if you don't get the filter up you can't put the stent then ultimately you're out of luck so you gotta have a different option filters may not provide complete cerebral protection if they're not fully opposed and again it does

allow passage of really tiny particles right so your blood cells have to be able to pass but even though it's less than about a hundred microns may be significant enough to cause a significant stroke if it goes to the

right basket of territory so it's not perfect protection and then if you have so much debris you can actually overload the filter fill it up in tile and entirely and then you have a point where when you capture the filter there's some

residual debris that's never fully captured either so these are concerns and then ultimately with that filter in place you can cause a vessel dissection when you try to remove it or if it's bouncing up and down without good

stability you can cause spasm to the vessel as well and so these are the things that we look for frequently because we want to make sure that ultimately if we just sent the lesion but we don't believe the vessel distal

to it intact and we're going to have a problem so here's some kind of illustrated diagrams for this here's a sheath in the common carotid artery you see your plaque lesion in the internal carotid artery and you're trying to

cross this with that filter device that's what's the picture on the right but as you're crossing that lesion you're you're liberating a little plaque or debris which you see here and during that period of time until the filters in

place you're not protected so all that debris is going up to the brain so there's that first part of the procedure where you're not protected that's one of the pitfalls or concerns particularly with very stenotic lesions or friable

lesions like this where you're not protected until that filters in place that first step you never are protected in placement of a filter here's an example where you have a torturous internal carotid artery so you see this

real kink these are kinds of carotid internal carotid arteries that we can see and if you place that filter in that bend that you can see right at the bend there the bottom part the undersurface of the carotid doesn't have good wall

my position of the filter so debris can can slip past the filter on the under under surface of this which is a real phenomenon and you can see that you can say well what if we oversize the filter if you oversize the filter then it then

it just oval eyes Azure or it crimps and in folds on itself so you really have to size this to the specific vessel that you plan to target it in but just the the physics of this it's it's a tube think about a balloon a balloon doesn't

conform to this it tries to straighten everything out this isn't going to straighten the vessel out so it doesn't fully conform on the full end of the filter and you have incomplete a position and therefore

incomplete filtration so this is another failure mode I mentioned before what if it gets overloaded so here's a diagram where you have all this debris coming up it's filling up the really tiny tiny particles go past it because this little

micro sieve allows really small particles to go distal but approximately it's overloaded so now you get all this debris in there you place your stent you take your retrieval filter or catheter to take this filter out and all that

stuff that's sitting between the overloaded filter and your stent then gets liberated and goes up to the brain so you got to worry about that as well I mentioned this scenario that it builds up so much so that you can't get all the

debris out and ultimately you lose some and then when the filter is full and debris particles that are suspended near the stent or if you put that filter too close to the edge of the stent you run into problems where it may catch the

stent overall and you have all of this debris and it looks small and you don't really see it and geographically obviously but ultimately is when you do a stroke assessment and it's not always devastating strokes but mild symptoms

where he had a stroke neurologist and the crest trial or most of the more recent clinical trials we actually evaluate a patient and notice that they had small maybe sub sub clinical or mild strokes that were noted they weren't

perhaps devastating strokes but they had things that caused some degree of disability so not insignificant here's a case example of a carotid stent that was done this is a case out of Arizona proximal carotid

stenosis stent placed but then distal thrombus that developed in this case and had post rhombus removal after the epd was removed so there's thrombus overloaded the the filter you can see the filter at the very top of the center

image you can see the sort of the shadow of the embolic protection device there distally aspirated that took the filter out and then ultimately removed but you can imagine that amount of thrombus up in the brain would have been a

devastating stroke and this is what the filter looks like in real life so this is what the debris may look like so it's not this is not overloaded but that's significant debris and you can see the little film or sieve that's on the

distal part of this basket and that's what captures the debris any of that in the brain is gonna leave this patient with a residual stroke despite a successful stenting procedure so this is what we're trying to avoid so in spite

are there any questions yeah yes that's a really good sure so the question was do you have any rules or guidelines in my institution about how long the procedure can be before you start

talking about anesthesia versus sedation is that right and positioning prone supine we did come up with a guideline with within our department we looked at a little bit of research but honestly was more expert opinion just best

practice and experience I in in general I would say if the procedure is 3 plus hours the patient should know they're going to be on the table not asleep for three plus hours and talk to them about what that means and if they're ok with

that I just think again that comes into setting realistic expectations that's one of the reasons actually that we're very interested in using Dex med otama Dean because that's going to be a better

drug for those longer procedures first was giving functional and versed for four hours it's just not it's not appropriate but you know and some people would say we'll just get an anesthesiologist them but a lot of these

patients are really thick so in our institution anesthesia is just really super regulated and they require all of these clearances for their involvement no matter what they're giving sometimes they'll require all these clearances and

they give exactly what we were going to give so you know it's it's really a juggling act I would say in our department we really just make sure the patient knows what the expectation is and then we'll usually say to the

provider to if if something goes like if anything looks a little concerning during the case we're stopping and they have to be ok with that and they are they really are but that took a lot of work to get everybody on board with that

type of communication yeah we don't know so they I know I think Sloane is anyone here from Sloane no I think Sloane has with dedicated anesthesiologists they work really closely with them and it's easier for

them to get cases scheduled they will give us they will assign us an anesthesiologist for the day but if we don't have any anesthesia cases they get reassigned somewhere in the o.r and it's a different analysis every time it tends

to be the same group some are stricter than others some will have a patient say I really want anesthesia and we can call up the provider and there they say no problem let me do a quick chart review whereas the next day the provider goes

no absolutely not send them for clearances that's a little tricky yeah right so what I showed you is from the american society of anesthesiology i am not affiliated with them at all i just think they bide non anesthesiologist

sedation so i rely heavily on what they say and they recommend waiting till peak effects so i would look at the pharmacokinetics so for versed it's 3 to 5 minutes so i would wait at least 3 minutes before your readmit a stirring I

think a good example with that is when diazepam with the sedative of choice the on the peak effect for diazepam is 1 minute so when midazolam came onto the market there were a lot of adverse outcomes

with patients because providers administering it weren't familiar with the pharmacokinetics and assumed that the peak effect for versed was the same for diazepam so in theory you could give a patient in 5 minutes 5 milligrams of

versed so by the time that fully hits them they could be in a negative 5 on your raft scale so you know just look at those pharmacokinetics look at that peak effect and I would use that to drive your dosing scheme Atlee that's what I

do and I think since we've done that we've seen better meet info cities and better safety outcomes yes okay yeah we don't do that we do one thing with uterine fibroid embolization swear they'll do a superior mesenteric block

but otherwise we don't do any other type of regional blocks but I have read about that I think that's really are the IR providers giving the block okay right I've seen two with uterine fibroid embolization we'll do an epidural in

advance some I think some institutions or some literature exists about that it's interesting it would be interesting if the IR providers could actually give it though I'm not sure if that's kosher in the anesthesia world but they're

certainly qualified to do it they they do already kind of do it really but so I mean that's certainly something interesting and if you have a provider that is comfortable taking that on and their institution I think it's worth

looking at because anything that's sort of I think mixes things up and and provides a different Avenue especially for high-risk patients is worth looking into definitely yes I believe it yeah

mm-hm right so I'll just repeat what she said so just jumping on the talk about blocks so in her institution they the providers to administer blocks and I think you said

coleus estas Tamizh and PTC's and biliary dream placements they'll use that and it will decrease the amount of sedation that's required sedation being versed and fentanyl that's required during the case which like yes like you

said is really great for patients who are already on opioids previously and habit aller ins yes [Music] something right so we again he left same provider though had a patient on Groupon

or Fein and it was our first experience within about a year ago and it was terrible and she did not have realistic expectations going in of how sedated she would be and she was very very unhappy

afterwards so we talked a lot about that and in that guideline I had mentioned that we made about when we involve anesthesia and when we don't there's a caveat about that that says that if a patient is on

methadone or buprenorphine that a discussion needs to take place making them aware that they will probably not feel very sedated but we will try our best and if they're not comfortable with that we reschedule the procedure with

anesthesia but they have to know going into it that they they may not feel completely sedated and we just keep that open and honest communication but we haven't really come up with a scheme of what's best we did actually try with her

we had her come in one day having taken her buprenorphine the day of the procedure and she seemed okay with that and then we tried having her go off of it so that the receptors wouldn't be blocked she was not happy with that

experience so that's really when a person like that probably would do great with propofol but we can't give propofol so you know if the and if the patient tells us no then we just reschedule with the anesthesia

right - hmm right right right you could at least if they're if they're on an opioid uh if they're on people nor Fein then in theory they should respond to the verse said you could go heavier hand it on the

versed just to get them sedated but they will probably still feel pain but it they hopefully won't remember it that's true I you know with the Richmond agitation sedation scale that's not going to fit every patient that's a

really good point I gave a patient seven of versed during an adrenal vein sampling and she was just talking my ear off I got I fed are you okay you know do you need me to give you anything else no no I'm good I'm good and then I wheeled

her out we got her in the recovery area and she goes sit over I said yeah she said wow I don't I don't remember anything the power of her said that that was like a true and music effect I hadn't seen that so strongly in a

patient before but if you if I had done you know I was documenting that she was a zero it looked like I wasn't doing much for her but then I was putting comments you know patient comfortable denying needing any more sedation so

won't fit every patient so it is good to look at that but yeah as far as the buprenorphine I mean it's it's it's tough yeah if they have an addiction specialist I would say talk to them and they might be

able to come up with a scheme that works for them and if there's a lot of pain expected afterwards those patients are gonna have to be on parenteral opioid therapy they'll probably have to stay you know if you're in a hospital they

would have to stay overnight so those are all things you have to consider yeah yes hmm yeah I'm like it so Adam and Alexa are nurse practitioners that we work with and I'm looking at Adam because

this is actually was a very hot topic for us in the last six months so we actually cheat we met with our sedation committee that's run by that in a physiologist who's blocking us from using pres of X and discuss with him

that in the protocol that guides our practice it's said that you did the timeout and then gave sedation but Ari anesthesiologists don't do that right so they intubate the patient and everything and then and they and then the provider

comes in and does the timeout right before the puncture or incision so we talked about to him about how well if we're gonna do the latency to peak effect it's not enough time right so we do now bring the patient in and start

sedation right away our orders are put in in advance I know some by the attending or the Li P so we have a PRN dose and with an a certain number of occurrences and a titrate to a certain Ross scale

yes yeah so and that our anesthesiologist mentions that our providers are present but it's it's a certain use of the language I think it might be like direct observation or immediately available and our providers

are immediately available it's up to your hospital so our profit our providers aren't like down the street on their way in to work with coffee and street clothes and we're sedating they're they're just down the hall maybe

or the way our department looks is we have a control area and it's like the you know the Central Station and you can see all of the rooms so they might be in the Central Station but just haven't gone in to do the time out yet that

being said I always talk to them before I bring the patient in and say what's the goal Rath and I address any concerns that I have and I think people think I'm a little kooky when I do that for every case but it I think it works really well

and I think the providers really like it so we just already start from the Gecko our line of communication I tell them the patient seems really anxious this is my plan what do you think agree disagree yes the procedural if does the procedure

list or the Lak but I've sedated the patient so the patient if you look at what Jayco describes in the universal protocol it's ideal if they can participate in the timeout however not required because then when they do the

timeout they're right there stabbing them with lidocaine so I like to you know I mean I would argue that by starting I would argue about that by starting at the sedation earlier and getting the patient into a comfortable

state you're more safe because you're doing the dosing appropriately according to the a sa yeah correct right right right

okay I think it's important to say though it's not about getting around Joint Commission this is what Joint Commission says you may feel uncomfortable with it and that's okay

but it is what our accrediting body says is okay we're also not intimating the patient and paralyzing them like an Asst the anesthesiologist is now having said that it's not like we walk the patient in and we go oh I think you're mr. Jones

we throw you on the table there is an initial timeout that's done with the nurse and the technologist and the other people in the room shaking his head yes as so the acceptable amount of time after reversal

yes so if it happens if it happens mid procedure you need to it's I believe the language the a sa uses that you have to have a discussion amongst the care team about whether or not you're going to proceed if it happens after the

procedure in the recovery area or it happens mid procedure and you abort then it has to be at least two hours before you discharge that patient or move them back to their unit where they came from because of that recitation effect and

because you can have really adverse effects from sedation like flumazenil can cause serious delirium I had a patient like that one time it was it was awful and it can cause serious cardiac arrhythmia so at least two hours if you

continue with the procedure I would just make sure everyone knows that you have to be really careful with recitation effects and and all of the adverse effects that you'd be looking at yes I think one more question I'm sorry

with hyperkalemia I have come across I want to say it was in perioperative guidelines when I was looking at the labs that we do cuz we do a lot of unnecessary labs in our department you guys might - I feel like we just really

overdo it I believe the perioperative recommendations are to check a serum potassium if the patient has a reason to have hyperkalemia however right if their hyperkalemic and

they develop a cardiac arrhythmia you know could hypoxia also precipitate that cardiac arrhythmia the results from the hyperkalemia maybe I just went in I wouldn't take an ounce

I would I would consider hyperkalemia severe hyperkalemia and unstable patient because that patient could go into a fatal arrhythmia so I would correct that before you bring them into an elective Percy what's often an elective procedure

so if you're doing a fistula gram you know right five point yeah why are we will go up to five point eight we personally will go up to five point eight because a lot of times they're hyperkalemic

because they're fish too less clothes now and we need to open it right so just again it I don't think there's ever going to be any hard and fast data that you see it's all about making sure everyone knows this patient has a serum

potassium of five point eight we're going to be really closely watching the ECG monitoring yeah thank you everyone thank you so much [Applause]

it's obviously either done with general

anesthesia or perhaps a regional block at our institution is generally done with general anesthesia we have a really combined vascular well developed combined vascular practice we work closely with our surgeons as well as

you know those who are involved in the vascular interventional space as far as the ir docs and and in this setting they would do generally general anesthetic and a longitudinal neck incision so you've got that and the need for that to

heal ultimately dissect out the internal carotid the external carotid common carotid and get vessel loops and good control over each of those and then once you have all of that you hyper NIH's the patient systemically not unlike what we

do in the angio suite and then they make a nice longer-term longitudinal incision on the carotid you spot scissors to cut those up and they actually find that plaque you can see that plaque that's shown there it's you know actually

pretty impressive if you've seen it and let's want to show an illustrative picture there ultimately that's open that's removed you don't get the entirety of the plaque inside the vessel but they get as much as they can and

then they kind of pull and yank and that's one of the pitfalls of this procedure I think ultimately is you don't get all of it you get a lot more than you realize is they're on on angiography but you don't get all of it

and whatever is left sometimes can be sometimes worse off and then ultimately you close the wound reverse the heparin and closed closed it overall and hope that they don't have an issue with wound healing don't have an issue with a

general anesthetic and don't have a stroke in the interim while they've clamped and controlled the vessel above and below so here's a case example from our institution in the past year this is a critical asymptomatic left internal

carotid artery stenosis pretty stenotic it almost looks like it's vocally occluded you can see that doesn't look very long it's in the proximal internal carotid artery you can see actually the proximal external carotid artery which

is that kind of fat vessel anteriorly also looks stenotic and so it's going to be addressed as well and this is how they treated it this is the exposure in this particular patient big incision extractors place and you can see vessel

loops up along the internal and external carotid arteries distally along some early branches of the external carotid artery off to the side and then down below in the common core artery and ultimately you get good vessel control

you clamp before you make the incision ultimately take out a plaque that looks like this look how extensive that plaque is compared to what you saw in the CT scan so it's not it's generally much more

impressive what's inside the vessel than what you appreciate on imaging but it's the focal stenosis that's the issue so ultimately if yet if the patient was a candidate stenting then you just place a stent

across that and he stabilized this plaque that's been removed and essentially plasti to that within the stent so it doesn't allow any thrombus to break off of this plaque and embolize up to the brain that's the issue of raw

it's the flow through there becomes much more turbulent as the narrowing occurs with this blockage and it's that turbulent flow that causes clot or even a small amount of clot to lodge up distally within the intrical in

terrestrial vasculature so that's the issue here at all if you don't take all that plaque out that's fine as long as you can improve the turbulent blood flow with this stent but this is not without risk so you take that plaque out which

looks pretty bad but there are some complications right so major minor stroke in death an asset which is a trial that's frequently quoted this is really this trial that was looking at medical therapy versus carotid surgery

five point eight percent of patients had some type of stroke major minor so that's not insignificant you get all that plaque out but if you know one in twenty you get a significant stroke then that's not so bad I'm not so good right

so but even if they don't get a stroke they might get a nerve palsy they might get a hematoma they may get a wound infection or even a cardiovascular event so nothing happens in the carotid but the heart has an issue because the

blockages that we have in the carotid are happening in the legs are happening in the coronary so those patients go through a stress event the general anesthetic the surgery incision whatever and then recovery from that I actually

put some stress on the whole body overall and they may get an mi so that's always an issue as well so can we do something less invasive this is actually a listing of the trials the talk is going to be available to you guys so I'm

not going to go through each of this but this is comparing medical therapy which I started with and surgery and comparing the two options per treatment and showing that in certain symptomatic patients if they have significant

stenosis which is deemed greater than 70% you may be better off treating them with surgery or stenting than with best medical therapy and as we've gotten better and better with being more aggressive with best medical therapy

this is moving a little bit but here's the criteria for treatment and so you have that available to you but really is

so my name's Heather I'm a nurse in interventional radiology at NYU Langone health in New York and I am the clinical resources for our department so what that means is I'm responsible for individualizing our education to meet the needs of our department and one of

the first things I wanted to look at when I took on the role was our procedural sedation practices and how we can improve by enhancing our knowledge this presentation includes many of the lessons and concepts that I learned

along the way that I think are really important to understanding how to effectively administer procedural sedation so our learning objectives are going to be a review of the guidelines pre-procedure assessment components

including airway assessment pharmacology of the medications that we give and intra procedure assessment so this is the 2018 AAS a practice guidelines for a procedural sedation by non anesthesiologist has everyone seen this

good great as so this is especially important because as you'll see the American College of Radiology and Society of interventional radiology were involved in its development so this is our guideline and I think it's really

important to look at this look at the practice recommendations and see how they align with your own practice and if there may be some changes you need to make first thing you always want to look at when you're reviewing any sort of

literature whether it's evidence-based guidelines or maybe just a review article is you want to look at the methodology that the author used to create the guideline so anybody know why that's important you just shout it out

so if I want to write a guideline for procedural sedation I could find a bunch of studies or review articles that fit my point of view and use them throw them at the bottom and that would be that but even if I use for an demise control

trials which are considered the gold standard of experimental research those randomized controlled trials could be poorly constructed randomized controlled trials so they may have introduced bias at some point into the study

that's skewed the outcome and the findings so you really want to make sure that the authors of the guideline that you're looking at appraise the research that they're using to support their recommendations and that's what the

aasa' task force did so they used randomized control trials and observational studies and then they categorize the strength and the quality of the study findings so as you're going through you'll see that statistically

significant was deemed a p-value of less than 0.01 and outcomes were designated as either beneficial harmful or equivocal equivocal meaning this findings were not significant one way or the other and then they also used

opinion based evidence from experts so they surveyed members of their task force and they did take into account some informal opinion from message boards and letters to the editor so I think a good example here is one of

their recommendations about capnography so they did a meta-analysis of randomized control trials that indicated that the use of continuous and title carbon dioxide monitoring was associated with a reduced frequency of hypoxemic

events when compared to monitoring without capnography and then you'll see at the end of the recommendations this category so for this particular recommendation they labeled it as category a1 - B evidence and what that's

telling you as category a means it was a randomized control trial which is great it was a level one meaning it's a high level of strength and quality and B is telling you that there was statistically significant findings that demonstrated

benefit to the patient now another recommendation that you may see as you're reading through would be the NPO guidelines so if you look at any of the literature about NPO recommendations it's really all expert

opinion because all of the evidence has shown equivocal findings so for example one of the studies they looked at compared the outcomes of patients who had clear liquids one hour prior to the procedure versus two hours and they

found no change in the outcome I think it's important when you're a provider and you're looking at that because you're gonna base your judgment calls on the evidence so you may have a patient come in who had tea up until one hour

prior to their procedure and you have to make a decision whether or not you want to cancel or proceed and you could look at the findings of the literature that shows that there really hasn't been a proven difference in outcomes so you may

decide to just do the procedure versus capnography there's very strong evidence showing it's beneficial to the patient always so I think this is a real big take-home point of why we do everything we do about procedural sedation all of

our assessments and enhancing our practice as a sedation is a continuum and practitioners intending to produce a given level of sedation should be able to rescue the patients whose level of sedation becomes deeper than initially

intended pre-procedure our assessment

briefly mention this because dr. sista

is gonna talk more about this on Tuesday but this is a slide from MGH where they started the pulmonary embolism response team and this is sort of how things used to be and I think most hospitals across the country and still exist in some

places where a patient shows up with PE and then about 20 different teams are consulted and kind of wait for everyone to say what they think you know vascular surgery may if they're involved may say something cardiology is gonna say one

thing ir is going to be involved and say something the critical care teams are going to say something and you're waiting for everyone to sort of get consensus which you may actually never get and all the while a patient is

sitting in the ER finding it difficult to breathe maybe probably an oxygen maybe not on a heparin drip and then what are you gonna do with that patient well what's the right treatment and then where are they going to go afterwards

and how are we gonna monitor them in their future well after the pulmonary embolism response teams have started showing up throughout the country it's a much more streamlined process patient shows up with a knee to the ER at our

institution a page is sent out after they're seen by the ER team and that involves a medical team usually vascular medicine or the pulmonary critical care IR interventional cardiology if they're involved the critical care services and

whatever whatever service initiated that and then it sort of goes through that process where the patient gets gets a consult from a multidisciplinary team much like a tumor board and we make a general consensus in our institution

this happens within 30 minutes of the patient hitting the door at this point so there's no longer like a two or three-hour wait to make a decision it may not always be the right decision but if that patient for example gets worse

over there the next two hours if we decide we're going to just treat them with anticoagulation and oxygen and telemetry in 30 minutes they may get worse and then we have another call and we make another decision and then we may

say you know what push TPA or they need to come to IR to get a catheter based intervention and again dr. or sisters can talk more about this but it really helps us with disposition and treatment

questions comments and accusations please hello this topic is very personal to me I've had it actually had a UFE so this is like one of my big things I work in the outpatient center as well as a

hospital where we perform you Effy's and frequently the radiologist will have me go in and talk to the patient it's from a personal perspective one of the issues which it may just have been from my situation was pain control post UFE

whether you normally tell your patients about pain control after the UFE someone say we are all struggling with this yeah oh it's not what's your question is going to be okay good I'm gonna get doctor Dora to answer Shawn the question

is what do you what do we do with this pain issue you know what are you doing for the home there at Emory there you know and a lot of practices we we don't rely on one magic bullet for pain control recently we've been doing

alternate procedures for two adjunctive procedures to help with pain control for example there are nerve blocks that you can do like a superior hypogastric nerve block there's there's Tylenol that can be given intravenously which is seems to

be a little more effective than by mouth there's there's a you know it and a lot of times it's it's a delicate balance right between pain post procedural pain because you can often get the pain well controlled with with narcotics opioid

with a pain pump but the problem is 12 hours later the patients is extremely nauseous and that's what keeps her in the hospital so it's a it's a balance between pain control and nausea you can you can hit the nausea

beforehand using a pain and scopolamine patch that that'll get built up in the system during the procedure and that kind of obviates the nausea issues like I said that the the nerve blocks the the tile and also there are some other

medicines that can can be used adjunctive leaf or for pain control in addition to to the to the opioids so the answer the question is there are multiple there multiple answers to the question there's not one magic bullet so

that helped it did one of the things that I tell the patients is that you know everyone is different and yet some people I've seen patients come out and they have no pain they're like perfect and then some come out and they are

writhing in the bed and they're hurting and they're rolling all around what and I always ask the acid docs are you telling them they could possibly have you know pain after the procedure because some have the expectation that

I'm going to be pain-free and that's not always the case so they have an unrealistic expectation that I'm gonna have the UFE but not have pain what I also tell them is that the pain it's kind of like an investment right and

this is easy for a guy to say that right but but it's it's an investment the worst part the worst pain you should be feeling is the first 12 12 hours or so every day I tell my patient you're gonna be getting better and better and better

with far as the pain as long as you is you follow our little cookbook of medicines that we give you on the way home and I want you to make sure that you fill these prescriptions on the way home or you have someone fill those

prescriptions for you before he or she picked you up in the hospital and lately we have been and I see that you're there as well lots of other little tricks that are out there right and again there are all

little tricks so ensure arterial lidocaine doctor there is near alluded to and if you're on si R Connect you may it may spill over on some of your chat rooms here people have been using like muscle relaxant like flexural or

robertson with some success but just know that we don't have any studies that tell us how that's supposed to do so when i have someone that is like writhing in pain i just use everything so i do it superior hypogastric nerve

vlog and i actually will do some intra-arterial lidocaine although not so much lately i have been using the muscle relaxant but i will warn you that i've had two patients with extreme anticholinergic effects where they are

now not able to pee from that so you know where we're doing that balance act I see that you're there can I take that question here first just so we're we're doing the same thing we're using the multimodal just throwing all these

things at people and we're trying the superior hypogastric blocks but we're collaborating with anesthesia to do that right now do you all do your own blocks or do you collaborate with anesthesia we do our own blocks okay it isn't it is

not that difficult I would tell you that but again it's kind of like you know you got to do if you start feeling better and then you're like we don't really need them we'll just do it on our own okay thank you again yes what's the

acceptable interval between UFE and for IBF oh that's a your question what is the interval between UFE and IVF so if you wanted to get pregnant yeah and can you have a you Fe and then have an IVF like how long would you have to wait

wait and tell you before you can have that the IBF it I guess it really depends on the age of the patient because we know that that the threshold for which patient tend to have that inability to conceive

is around 45 years old so you know it did below the you know below the age of 45 the risk of causing ovarian failure or or the inability to conceive is significantly less it's zero zero to three percent so I would say that you

know you probably want the effects of the fibroid embolization to two to take effect it takes around 12 months for these fibroids to shrink down to their most weight that they're gonna they're going to shrink down the most I wouldn't

say you need to wait 12 months to put our nine vitro fertilization there's no good there's no good literature out there I don't believe that's your next and so I would say just remember that if you came to my practice and you said you

wanted to get pregnant I will be sending you to talk to fertility specialists beforehand we do not perform embolization procedures as a way to become pregnant there's no data to support that but if you saw your

gynecologist and they said let's do this then I'm sure they'll be doing lots of adjunct things to figure out what would be an ideal time then to for you to have IVF and if I dove not having any data to inform me I would ask you to wait a year

and what will be the effect of those hormones that they gave you if for example a patient has existing fibroids what would be the effect of those hormones that IVF doctors prescribed their patients yeah so fibroids actually

can grow during pregnancy so I would say that most of those hormones are pro fertility hormones so I would expect that maybe you can see some of that effect as well yeah alright if you have any other questions you can grab me oh

you're I'm sorry go with it okay yes we we have time I don't want to keep anybody here for that so I have a two-fold question the first one is post-procedure can you use a diclofenac patch or a 12-hour pain

patch that is a an NSAID have you have any experience with that and your next question my second part of the question is there a patient profile or a psychological profile that tips you that the patient is not going to be able to

candidate because of their issues around pain so they're two separate but we have in success sending people home that first day so I'm looking to just make it better I haven't had experience with the Clos

phonetic patch it's in theory it seems ok you know these are all the these are they're all these are non-steroidal anti-inflammatory drugs so there are different potency levels for all of them they you know they range from very low

with with naproxen to to a little bit higher with toradol like that clover neck I think is somewhere in between so we found that at least I found that that q6 our our tour at all it tends to help a lot so with that said I I don't have

much experience with it with the patch in answer to your second question the only thing I can say is there there is a strong correlation between size of fibroids and the the amount of a post procedural pain and post embolization

syndrome so there really you know we often say we don't really care too much about the number of fibroids but the size of the fibroid is is is should be you know you should you should look at that on pre procedural imaging because

if it gets too big it may not be worth it for the patient because they may be in severe pain the more embolic you put into the blood supply's applying the the fibroid the the greater the pain post procedural pain

are there multiple other factors that would contribute to pain but that's that's one aspect you can you can look at post procedurally on imaging okay thank you very much yes ma'am hi what what kind of catheter do you use

to catheterize the fibroid artery when you pass by radio access yeah so over the last three years the companies have been really very good about that so there are a few things that I without endorsing one company or the other that

you need to make sure that the sheath that you're using is one of those radial sheets a company that makes a radio sheath you should not use a femoral sheath for radial access so no cheating where that's concern you may get away

with it once or twice but it will catch up to you and you need a catheter that is long enough to go from the radio to the to the groin so I'm looking for like a 120 or 125 centimeter kind of angled catheter whether it's hydrophilic the

whole way or just a hydrophilic tip or not at all you can you can choose which one in our practice most of us still tend to use a micro catheter through that catheter although if I'm using a for French and good glide calf and it

just flips into like a nice big juicy uterine artery then I may just go ahead and take that and do the embolization if the fellow is not scrubbed in as well so thanks a lot but they make they make many different kinds like that and more

of those are to come all right I'm you can please please please send us any other questions that you have thanks for your time and attention and enjoy the rest of the living

I'm Nikki Jensen Nicole is what my mother calls me but that's alright thank you all for joining us today I am the clinical resource nas I work in a clinical nurse specialist position I graduated in May so I'll finally be called the clinical nurse specialist

after I passed my boards in nonvascular radiology so at Mayo Clinic Rochester we are kind of split up between I are in our IR practice where we have non vascular procedural Center CT MRI ultrasound guided procedures we'll go

over a list of our standard perform procedures as well as our neuro interventional and vascular interventional practice so Kerri and I work in the non vascular so we do not do any neuro interventional or vascular

vascular interventional procedures so these guidelines are going to focus on your LR CT or ultrasound guided procedures how many of you went to the combined session this morning great this is going to be an overview because what

we saw presented there really reiterates what we are have brought into our practice but then we're also going to share how we created nursing guidelines and how we rolled that into our practice this is Carrie Carrie is a staff nurse

in our department I worked as a staff nurse for seven years prior to this position I've been in this position now for four years and really enjoy it I do want to give a little shout-out to Carrie and I presented or sorry we

published an article in the June 28th volume 37 issue - that really coincides with our presentation today so I would encourage you to read that publication and then you'll get additional information on how we did this yes all

right we have nothing to disclose unfortunately or fortunately right so the purpose of this presentation is to help you all understand the importance of creating reviewing the literature

understanding your for one your coagulation casket as well cascade as well as anticoagulants that are out there or new up-and-coming medications and understanding that yes it's very important to establish and create these

guidelines so that within your practice you don't have differing radiologists that have differing opinions if you're working with doctor so-and-so today you need to worry about these labs if you're working with you know dr. Johnson

tomorrow he doesn't care about the labs we did this to help standardize that to help reduce the amount of questions our nurses have how many times we're interrupting our radiologists but then also we need to take into consideration

the importance of the patients and their different disease processes and we'll be going over that too so it's nice to have established guidelines but then also we need to take into consideration why patients are on certain medications this

here is our list of objectives I'm not going to read them for you you can all read them and we've provided you all with handouts too but really we want to just help kind of explain mechanism of actions and different medications and

how we established our guidelines this here is where Kari and I come from full disclosure we do have snow on the ground so these pictures were not taken before we came we are really enjoying this nice warm weather but for those of you who

are not familiar with the history of Mayo Clinic in Rochester who we have a hundred and fifty plus year tradition of implementing evidence-based care to assure the needs of our patient come first we are divided up into one

downtown campus but we have three different main areas so we have our st. Mary's Hospital this is where Kerry is based out of this is this houses most all of our ICUs as well as most all of our inpatients so we do a lot of

inpatients but we also see outpatients in this hospital Rochester Methodist Hospital this is where our he mock patients typically are we do have one ICU within Hospital as well but then right here my

office is right there this is our Mayo downtown campus so this is where most of our patients come for outside procedures or outpatient diagnostic imaging exams this here is the group that I'm part of the clinical nursing specialist group

within our clinical nursing specialist group there are 77 of us there are five like myself clinical resources as we have not graduated as of yet I'm right there in the middle w

that work in over 70 ambulatory areas in 58 inpatient areas we also support some areas in our Arizona and Florida campuses and then we have Mayo Clinic Health System hospitals that are scattered throughout Iowa

Wisconsin in Minnesota as well I am the only one in radiology across all of our

good morning I don't know if this is on oh it is in terms of reducing delays in your department did you have to do any work around realistic scheduling of procedures putting standard procedure times around different procedures or how

to manage when procedures go and you know run long or you have difficulty managing that aspect of the schedule I'm sorry the audio is unclear it's a little fuzzy up here so you scale and we'll repeat it

yes we did a lot a lot of work around scheduling and that's really Monique in there with the intake Center talked in the intake center we are then we actually have the nurses schedule their procedures and then we hand off to the

schedulers to actually put them in but this way the nurse who's doing an intake can actually determine how long the procedure should be so it allows us to have clinical eyes on the length of the procedure so we modified sort of our

basic list of how long procedure should take we roll in 30 minutes of turnaround time and then we add another 30 minutes if it's an anesthesia case now if the case is going to say require a likely intervention and we can tell oh yes

that's gonna need more time than we schedule accordingly we add time so we really worked hard to make sure that we were scheduling accurate case lengths yeah we constantly analyze those case lengths and continuously try to improve

and recognize challenges hello I'm Nikki Jensen I work in a clinical resource mares clinical nurse specialist roll Mayo Clinic Rochester and I'm very curious about two things first thing is routine lab work and read reduction of

unnecessary labs we too have been doing this where we kind of have taken our own clinical practice expertise and compared with us IR guidelines and have reduced drastically our lab work needed have you guys created established guidelines to

help standardize your process or is this a physician to physician now we we do have a list of procedures that require certain labs for certain procedures again we have a nurse performing the intake so if there's a reason we have

sort of some exclusions so end-stage liver disease we are going to get the pt/inr but if it's a routine meta port placement or line placement we're not going to get pre-op labs so we kind of do a quick assessment in advance over

the phone oftentimes and we make a determination as to what's needed if there is any question then we do go to our physicians but yes we have a list of which procedures new labs and we really knocked out most of our PTI in ours and

then my second question is regarding your patient surveys I love those because us too we do not have really great patient satisfaction surveys available for radiology practice how did you find that is it a particular company

that you went through how did you get this yes so and I can give you more details if you'd like to email me but we because I said we had a we have a patient chief patient experience officer at

Johns Hopkins she was able to get us in on the ground floor of this little mini pilot the pilot was so hugely successful that we adopted it across much of Hopkins out patience and also 23 our Admissions

were allowed to use these the main sort of national surveys that need to there's a requirement that the inpatients have to receive those first you're not allowed to supersede with your own but this company actually was just recently

purchased by one of the major major Chris Kane these two doctors just invented this and all of a sudden now everybody really Press Ganey and talk by various thank you guys I don't know how they're rolling it out and whatnot but

hi I'm Marissa from Houston Methodist Hospital in your title did you write that phase two it says I our patient experience and throughput lean Sigma and Phase two is that is this your face too in your title is this our face Christo

and what was your face one phase one was reducing our procedure rim downtime the time between cases and interestingly for phase one we assumed that that would also reduce our patient delays but guess what at the end we found out it had

introduced our patient Dilys we had great success with you know getting our rooms running back-to-back better our patients back-to-back better but we were surprised so as the next steps on our phase one that was what we wanted to

work on patient delays okay and what's the approximate the corresponding cost of your project because it seems like it's an interdisciplinary what do you have a cost for the whole project sorry that makes just a little fuzzy on that

side so we really saved money for our department and our hospital by implementing this we are just all frontline staff we happen to have a radiology resident who knew how to write code so wasn't his day job

but he was really great I'm raining code and we ended up creating this delay dashboard so that's what I would say to everyone like you never know the strengths of the people who you have but to just ask questions

and brainstorm it's amazing what you can come up with so the the only thing that we really like spent money on would be the bedside service but that ended up being so the manpower for the Qi team is all in-house so we didn't necessary

invest specific but the projects that required hospital support was embedding a PA in the recovery area plus the bedside service and that totaled about you know seven eight hundred thousands it's a moving target but again if you

show metrics that validate why that that type of large number is validated and we it's find itself now but but strictly speaking a lot of the other initiatives were in-house in other but the East surveys was something the hospital was

going towards we just happened to tap into that so it's amazing how many resources you can get should you put the effort in but manpower wise the Qi entire team within IR what you see on front Chen this is just part of the

group is all in-house and not funded this is just part of our work thank you ask you about your inpatient who them on a daily basis who treats you in patients in patients so we have fellows and our fellows together with the four

coordinator like Jeff and add on the impatience but the fellows there's a ticket the fellows sort of is responsible for basically working up the impatient getting consents and then handing off and assisting the floor

coordinator or they had a conversation to determine where that we are and when that inpatient needs to so Jeff Jeff coordinates through the fellow and triage these cases and another question I have how do you schedule your

inpatient and outpatient s-- together in one day how do you differentiate the scheduling between inpatient and our patients how do we fit them into them so most of our rooms we schedule with outpatients

starting at the beginning of the day at 8 o'clock we have one room reserved for inpatients and sometimes we have another room reserved for inpatient lines that is a PA room so one or two inpatient rooms

the others are scheduled with outpatients and then as there are gaps in the schedule which we actually try to avoid those gaps now in patients can be popped in or can follow I see thank you I mean it strictly speaking if you or I

are inpatient come through in our consult fellow triage is it first once it's identified we're going to do a procedure then coordinates with our charge nurse or resource nurse plus the floor coordinator and then it's made to

happen so then the the mechanisms of appropriateness Labs prep is all done and consent done before the patient is transported down and then like Alison says we have a space a room dedicated for inpatients and then sometimes we'll

squeeze them in if it's more emergent origin if you don't mind Jeff can you can you just extent you know talk more about your role specifically what how do you communicate to the nurses upstairs when you coordinate the cases to come

down well every morning you know we get a list of known inpatients and then throughout the day the fellows will bring an add-on slips with pertinent labs and what we're doing when I know that I've got let me back up in the

morning will actually call all the units and speak to that patients nurse to say hey this is what we're gonna be doing are they NPO do they have an IV what kind of drips are they on so that way if the patient is not able to get their

procedure you know we can kind of head that off as a day goes on if I know I've got a room opening up in half an hour I'll call the nurse and say hey I'm sending transport up to get this patient this is what they're getting can you

and we'll just make sure that the patients ready so that way when transport gets there that the patient's ready to come down do you communicate these information to the a procedure nurse any sort of information that I get

there we do have the option to put notes in our EMR set the nurse can know that and a lot of times if if I'm able to I will walk down to the room and talk to the nurses and techs and whoever else needs to know that information and say

hey this is what we're doing what to prepare for and give them as much information as I can so they can be ready - got it thank you so much you yes I have some questions regarding the bedside service

that you guys offer how do you I guess I would say dictate or document the procedure where we are we used to have patients that we would go up to the floor and pull a line or change a tube or whatever and then our document

documentation system kind of got rid of that because we had to work around the computer system versus what was best for the patient so how do you document for those so part of the building of the team is critical is how you document and

importantly how you bill we need to make it financially viable so actually every procedure at the bedside we put into the radiology information system the accession numbers created and actually a before

those procedures are performed by physician assistants under the auspices of the attending on call and those are signed off as procedures then build in and so in that way we also document as well as make it billing compliant so

there's many advantages of actually doing that step and making sure that you get paid for what you do and not only that it's in the EMR exactly what happened and after they get I'm assuming you do some PICC lines bedside

chest x-ray after is that how they document this is how you verification some if it's our sign be verified or x-ray yep okay thank you hi I'm Heather from Sarasota Memorial I have two questions for your nurse intake person

and then the scheduler have you found that it's decreased your turnaround time and what is your turnaround time from receiving in order to proceed your time can you hear me so we receive there we have electronic

orders or they're in the EMR but when we do we require a lot of the providers to call us directly that communication piece is a big deal to be able to get all those questions answered and to get the patients scheduled appropriately so

as soon as they're putting in the order there a lot of them are calling us even as they're putting in the order so we I mean we receive lots of phone calls on a daily basis it's about five or six of us in the office at the same time answering

these phone calls so you have more than one nurse then that's fielding those yes yeah and the second thing for the bedside service do you send that PA or a mid-level person with a procedural person to assist in the room or is that

an expectation of the bedside nurse that they assist if needed that's a great question so there is you know some teething problems one of the problems you eliminated is doing procedures at the bedside you know how much do you

incorporate the the floor nurse involved with the case it's definitely become a little bit of a bone contention but we are managing it because the analogy the converse is that would be the internal medicine physician doing the procedure

and the nurse would be assisting anyway and sometimes it's just House staff internal medicine House staff doing it we're just doing it safer quicker so we've had to do a lot of Education with floor based nursing nursing leadership

to make everybody align that quickly turn around so we yeah but I think you raise a great point sometimes its resource at their bedside we right now we have one provider who goes with the ultrasound performs a procedure with

assistance of a clinic or the owners thank you last question please Fernando from Houston VA Medical Center can you hear me I have two questions so first question is do you guys see

schedule the same start time on all your I'd you sweets it can vary a little bit but we mostly start at 8 o'clock we have one day where we start at nine o'clock we sometimes start a room at eight o'clock except one day of the week which

is Thursday we start at 9:00 with education of anaesthesia our front land tech nurse physicians we all have our weekly education process from eight to nine so every day at eight except Thursdays at 9:00 standardized so then

we look at our first starts in that relation but so how many ones do you guys start all at the same time all the rooms and we start at 8 o'clock Oh second question so since the guys insert multiple drains in they are do you guys

primarily manage this drains including discharge instructions when patients are discharged can you apologize most of the time that would be yes there'd be a consult the primary team

would manage the patient's care be you know after the procedure going forward because they're usually managing their care for whatever problem there is for the abscess train or biliary drain now we our patients do pass through a pack

you the patients who are outpatients who are going to be going home or prior to admission oftentimes and the pack you will give basic instructions to ensure that the patient knows what to do with their drain before they go home

same thing with the intake so know as patient care coordinator nurses we're talking to the patient we're making sure that they have what they need or else we will help coordinate to make sure that they're getting what they need they know

what the plan is in patient often times they'll go back to the procedure room but it depends on whether they are have had anesthesia if they're off the sedation protocol they could go to pack you and then to their bed same-day

admission if the that's not ready pack you okay well thank you so much everyone and please feel free to contact us if you have additional and on behalf of Aaron avir I would like

baking breaking boundaries so one thing that we all like to do is brag right we took this filter out that's been in for 50 years and you know all that sort of stuff so here's a Greenfield that was

in for over 25 years green fields as you know as a permanent filter in this patient it's a Friday so it's got to go another shout out to filter Friday but here's a you know incredible case where he was able to

remove a filter that had been in for 25 years so here's here's one of my cases where I have this filter that I threw out there and I had seen this 16 year old truck be shredded and this is another Bob reuse case and so I kind of

got excited about actually doing this case that I don't know if I would have felt comfortable doing that but I see that here's another one from Manny that had another op DS filter that was that was able to be removed so by getting

this filter out I would post this picture and say how you know how would other people attach that so this is that IR to IR part here's another one that Agnes Solberg put out real nice thing I think I have a video here can you run

that video where she has this is more almost like an Instagram type post whoops go back there play that little video there so she has some live pictures of what's going on in the case and she's put some nice graphics and

things like that but this is you know it was like the Pinterest of Twitter of Twitter complex IVC filter retrievals so anyway so I had this case and I actually did the case and tweeted about it afterwards and then I got a reply from

Christopher Ballman who's a said nice to see it come out in one place I personally like laser sheathe as for this filter because I've had nonmetal sheaths tear on me and cause filter fracturing embolism looks like this

plastic sheath was close to the same so he's actually looking at my text and commenting on fact that he would have done something a little bit differently which i think is wonderful here's another one where the fracture embedded

10-year old filter if you look on the on the right they're removed with the laser here's one on the left where the same sort of case was removed with a laser so we're all kind of cross pollinating there there's tips and tricks so here's

somebody that Bradley Thomas who's actually a master surgeon what was that what would your stress the community what would your strategy be if you referred this from outside Hospital after a failed first 1/10 of course he

said hashtag asking for a friend I'd say CT if not redone forceps and wire loop any other thoughts so I saw this and I had this exact same case in the past before if you see this this is a 3d reconstruction of a filter that has

penetrated tilted and penetrated outside the IVC on the top and the bottom side I was able to snare that from above using a loop snare and I pulled hard enough that I actually bent the the head of the filter over and was able to remove it

through the sheath and so a couple weeks later Babri you posts his exact same filter that's bent over like this he called it the ragdoll filter which I really like I think I've replied to him and said it look like a solvent or dolly

picture with the filter draped across the tree and then a follow-up from Brad Thomas says there it goes it's out and he did the exact same thing he couldn't bent the filter over so none of us talked or anything like this this is all

posted on social media you learn a lot about emerging technologies you learn about filters that are coming down the road Peter Horner a good friend of mine from from Denver who I correspond with

probably a year on Twitter before we met at a conference and just met up and had a drink so he talks about this filter that opens up after a period of time it can it converts to a stent with six months

96% within six months and then you have the absorb alive EC filter coming out of Indiana again with links to the publication's on it just all sorts of really cool things where you can learn about these new emerging technologies I

can't wait to get my hands on this device is the Aptus device that are the captives device sorry I kind of doing that Bob Ryu has been involved with which is a different way of of grabbing the top of the filter that doesn't

require a snare doesn't require a loop it actually kind of molds over the top of it and grabs and pulls it out here's another picture of it and I love this one where where Bob if you got a if you don't follow Bob you gotta follow him

he's got the greatest sense of humor but he says I was filter out with my brand-spanking-new Colorado filter a fellow Demetri with the cap to spice ho-hum he says to me kids today I say to him and then now the penultimate which

is the captives plus the laser and then this is how Luke Skywalker likes to do is filter out there are parody accounts as well and this is my favorite if you guys don't know Scott tree atoll he's been at Penn forever he's the chief and

chair there and vehemently opposed to social media so somebody put this together and if you don't know this he he has strong opinions first of all and two he wears these sneakers and he only does his cases in these white sneakers

and he's been using the same pair of sneakers for like 25 years so here's a tweet where Bill Strava law post said I wore those shows with the case once in the better filter jumped off patients on its own so that's

another way to get a filter out I guess you just wear those sneakers so thank you for your attention [Applause]

about you rolled out the radiant in 2015 and all of this data is great but it's reliant on the nurses documenting it in

all their different areas so how did you did you actually when you built this dashboard did you leave blanks because you just didn't have the data available or did you circle back around and hold the nurses accountable how did you do

that trying to motivate them and engage them rather than it looking like a disciplinary action because you're showing that they're not documenting appropriately yes and that's part of our journey from 2013 we started all these

projects it became evident that document documentation was important when it came to the data and so we actually started training from our technologists and and then to our nurses we created standard work for how they documented time stamps

I'm at different points in the process we audit we audited that for a while to make sure that they were compliant with that documentation so so we embarked on a lot of projects and I did a to greenbelt projects I did one in

interventional radiology and I did one on beginning complete because you really have to start at the ground and if people's reporting is not good you have to fix it so we have a definition for beginning complete for our

technologists which cleaned their data up then we did a project with Jeannie's nurses around and Tommy did some auditing around the time stamps in their system and that took a long time so yes you have to clean your data up first

and that takes projects in order and we also did Tommy led all of us to look at our data and a data validate sort of like Gilbert's thing you know so is it really valid and so we did a lot of work around that as well

the nurses do with themselves and the nursing supervisor did it as well to make sure and the technologists help you with that because what we found is when we handed the data to the nurses and we had them do their audits it was more

impactful than when we did it how would you say your start times improved from pre project pre dashboard to current how did you measure that was the time yes so that was actually interesting especially in interventional radiology because it

it when we started rolling off the Huddle's and the dashboards we had some participation in the with the technologists and the nurses and the providers doing their Huddle's and looking at the information and then

there was a period of time when they stopped doing that and they actually and they actually saw a drop in there on time starts so when we started up they were around maybe 40% on-time start and then when they consistently did their

Huddle's and looked at the - would I use the information they quickly jumped to 60 65 percent so and when they stopped dropped again so it was sort of it proved that that the tools actually worked and now they're actually going

back and owning the work of their own to continue T their Huddle's and use the dashboards in real time yeah rome wasn't built in a day and would you say that this is significantly impacted employee engagement yes I will definitely say it

has previously we had a real sort of segmented nursing work you know silo's and now we have like this cohesive team of nursing and and physicians and technologists working together in IR I will say also part of

our leadership team crisp as part of this as well our senior leaders we did a job we did a change in sort of our leadership structure so before it was like the physicians they led their physicians the technologists led their

technician technologists and the nurses led theirs well we in got a team together so we have a nurse manager the chair of interventional radiology the nursing supervisor and the nursing technologist

and supervisor and we lead as a team now and so we look at volumes together we look at budgets together we look at staffing together so it's not no longer just leading in silos so with that consistency in that that that sort of

got them all together and then so then they see that you can't hit a technologist against a nurse in a physician against a nurse or a technologist because we're all one team and that was a big part of helping this

out yeah sorry before that I was just going to talk about how important leadership was in this so Chris is our operations manager and I would say she made all of this perseverance tommy's the brains I'm the Brawn so I

would like to ask you give more details on the culture like what you were just describing about becoming a multidisciplinary team sure um that's a good vision but practically how did you accomplish so the culture was really

really hard and my Greenbelt project that I did back in 2013 was not successful because of the culture and what we learned was that we had to do something about the culture Jeannie alluded to the fact that our our

department chair dr. chair Toth and our administrative director Karen Buttrey talked to me about this and and they decided it was important that they had leadership teams in each modality so every modality and radiology has a

leader it is the division director the technologists lead and if there's a nurse a nursing lead they meet once a month tommy's does the score cards for them they bring their score cards they bring their a3 reports on

their strategic plan and they sit as a group I sit with them as well and we talk about how they're aligning their strategy to their work what the culture is like and do we need help sometimes we bring HR in if we think we need help

and geney's done a lot of leadership training with the nurses she's very good at it we have Conaty so we've partnered with Dartmouth and we send different teams to Conaty to learn leadership training this

has been really this all started really in 2013 and it continues today and we work just as hard on it as we did in 2013 Neverending yeah and I was part of that Conaty training and it was phenomenal so

it was two of the IR physicians myself the business manager and another radiology technologist supervisor and so really we had to work on a project together and it really brought us together to understand each other's work

and for um I feel like probably the strongest you know asset I have is relationships and and making those connections and nursing wasn't my first career I did practice management and so I worked for a doctor's office and I

kind of know that you have to sort of make sure that everyone understands that we're all trying to get we're all trying to take care of the patient and we all have different responsibilities to do so and there's a crossover if we fight

against each other then nothing's going to work and so that was where I I feel like I probably did the best these again you know brains and brawn and I was just sort of like let's make it all work together people with it so

was that something that you had to work into the amount of hours that it takes to maintain the new task that was being asked for yes so the documentation is part of their work to take care of the patient so for a technologist for

example when they go get the patient from the waiting room they start the beginning the exam in Radian those are things they need to do - as part of the EMR to actually accomplish their work so that was by design already part of their

workflow we just had to make sure that they were all doing it at the same point in time so for example before we standardized the definitions we would have some technologists who would begin the exam when they went to go again the

patient some will do it after they had set up the rooms so we have to standardize all of it so the data was measuring at the same points and for the nurses as well as part of their documentation as they work up the

patient so it's all part of the flow the other thing we do that I want to mention quickly because we're out of time is rounding so rounding is really important so I am the operations manager I probably around three times a day in

every modality and as an example I was just in mr and I saw a red button on their dashboard and I said why aren't we 19 minutes behind and somebody had forgot to complete the exam and everybody was there and they were

talking to me about it and they said yep and they ran back and they you know so I stay engaged the supervisors Jeanne I have two other supervisors tomy rounds you have to keep the conversation going you can't just build these and think

they're gonna take care of themselves because they're not you have to really do that disciplined rounding work so thank you everyone very much yeah thank you and just some related articles that

other other institutions have used for healthcare dashboards I found really really great so I don't know if this is true but I think they're going to send the slides after yeah conference oh yeah yeah afterwards we're happy to stay here

thank you

quick I did want to mention t-carr briefly and try to get you guys closer to back on time this is a hybrid procedure this is combining the surgical procedure we talked about first and carotid stenting it takes combined

carotid exposure at the base of the clavicle or just above the clavicle and reverses blood flow just like we talked about but tastes slightly different technique or approach to doing this and then you put the stent in from a drug

carotid access here's the components of the device right up by the neck there is where the incision is made just above the clavicle and you have this sheet that's about eight French in size that only goes in about us to 2 cm or 1 and a

half cm overall into the vessel and then that sheath is sutured to the the chest wall and then it's got a side arm that goes what's labeled number six here is this flow reversal urn enroute neuroprotection kit it reverses the

blood flow and then you get a femoral sheath in the vein right in the common femoral vein and you reverse the blood flow so this is a case a picture from our institution up on the right is the patient's neck and that's the carotid

exposure and the initial sheath is in place so the sidearm of that sheath is the enroute protection system which is going up up at the top of the image there we're gonna back bleed that let that sidearm of that sheath continue to

bleed up to the very top and then connect that to the common femoral venous sheet that we have in place there's a stepwise of that and then ultimately what we see at the end of the procedure is that filter inside that

little canister can be interrogated after and you can see the debris this is in the box D here on the bottom left the debris that we captured during the flow reversal and this is a what we call a passive and then active flow reversal

system so once the system is in place the direct exposure carotid sheath in place the flow controller and AV shunt in place you see the direction of blood flow so now all that blood flow in that common carotid artery is going reverse

direction and so when you place a sheath or wire and and ultimately through that sheath up by the carotid artery there's no risk for distal embolization because everything is flowing in Reverse here's a couple

case examples ferns from our institution this is a patient who had a symptomatic critical greater than 90% stenosis has tandems to nose he's so one proximal at the origin and one a little bit more distal we you can see the little

retractors down at the base of the image there in the sheath that's essentially the extent of the sheath from the bottom of that image into the vessel only about a cm or two post angioplasty instant patient tolerated that quite well here's

another 71 year-old asymptomatic patient greater than 90% stenosis pretty calcified lesion a little more extensive than maybe with the CT shows there's the angiography and then ultimately a post stent placement using the embolic

protection device and overall the trials have shown good good safety met profile overall compared to carotid surgery so it's a minimum minimal exposure not nearly as large the risk of stroke is less because you're not mucking around

up there you're using the best of a low profile system with flow reversal albeit with a mini surgical exposure overall we've actually have an abstract or post trip this year's meeting this is just a snapshot of that you can check it out

this is our one year experience we've had comparable low complication rates overall in our experience so in summary

different applications renal ablation is very common when do we use it

high surgical risk patients primary metastatic lesions some folks are actually refused surgery nowadays and saying I'll have a one centimeter reno lesion actually want this in lieu of surgery people have

familial syndromes they're prone to getting a renal cancer again so we're trying to preserve renal tissue it is the most renal parenchymal sparing modality and obviously have a single kidney and a lot of these are found

incidentally when they're getting a CT scan for something else here's a very sizable one the patient that has a cardiomyopathy can see how big the heart is so it's you know seven centimeter lesion off of the left to superior pole

against the spleen this patient wouldn't have tolerated bleeding very much so we went ahead and embolized it beforehand using alcohol in the pide all in a coil and this is what it looks like when you have all those individual ice probes all

set up within the lesion and you can see the ice forming around I don't know how well it projects but in real time you can determine if you've developed your margin we do encompass little bit of spleen with that and you can see here

that you have a faint rim surrounding that lesion right next to the spleen and that's the necrotic fat that's how you know that you got it all and just this ablation alone caused a very reactive pleural

effusion that you can see up on the CT over there so imagine how this patient would have tolerated surgery pulmonary

so these are a lot of slides most limited you know I'm talking I'm talking to you guys I'm talking showing you a lot of technical stuff you know and a lot of slides and I'm gonna talk mostly technical of you know how tips and dips are done kind of a step by step so even

the title it's kind of a workshop step by step of how basically you do you do tips and dips and what and and what are they so in general when you have when you have this is basically kind of out flow spleen spleen dumps blood into the

portal vein the mesentery dumps blood into the portal vein portal vein goes into liver liver does its thing and then dumps the blood into the eppadi veins to the right atrium okay for that because the liver is connected with the spleen

and the guts in series unlike any other organ basically the liver has to be a low-resistance organ because the portal circulation is low-pressure look the liver has to be a low-resistance organ with liver disease especially liver

cirrhosis you actually get increased resistance and in the liver with that disease and you get basically a backup of the blood flow in the portal circulation and increases the pressure in the portal circulation that's kind of

the genesis of or the pathogenesis of portal hypertension backing up circulation the spleen and in the guts then you get ascites and hydra thorax that's kind of think of it as weeping of fluid into the pleural space and into

the and into the perineum part of it is oncotic part of is osmotic basically think of it nutritional and pressure driven causes at the same time we all have potential portosystemic connections in other words they're there but they're

not connected or they're not opened up in plumbing they hold them bleed valves or pressure valves when the pressure is high and you know they start weeping or leaking you know in your in your basements we have the same thing

we have so many portosystemic connections there are about 55 named ones there are innumerable ones that are actually that are actually not named the common ones that we know are because of because of bleeding is esophageal

varices that's the connection usually between the left gastric vein and the azekah can be hazardous system you can also get gastric varices and that's usually connecting between a spleen and the left renal vein through a gas renal

shunts you can get also all sorts of connections even down in the internal hemorrhoids we get actually portal hypertension hemorrhoids and bleeding and so many numerous other shunts that we just don't have time to cut to cover

it to cover all these so the general to the general thought of treating all these complications of portal hypertension is to decompress the system to reduce the pressure and that's along the lines of years and decades of

surgery shunts that were placed and now tips ism largely replaced all these surgical shunts with the exception of Vancouver and Tampa okay that they still do some surgical actually a lot of surgical shunts most most other places

in North America converge to a tip to a tip shunt the the advantage of the tips of over surgical shunts is the usual what we hear is minimally invasive it you know it's a quick recovery less morbidity and mortality areason for

white tips has beaten the surgical shunts is the transplant era all these surgical shunts are actually extrahepatic so when you go for a transplants and liver hits the buckets they actually have to go and shut down

these shunts wherever they created them steena renal portal cable in the tips it goes out with a liver in the bucket so there's no complication of transplantation that's the real advantage of tips over surgical shunts

and that's why it's become very very prevalent in in in North America with a transplant error when approaching gastric varices just briefly another way is a BRT Oh which is to go basically into the left renal vein go up the shunt

and specifically screw rows the stomach and that's not the that's not this kind of subject of our of our discussion here I'm gonna talk to you

know we're running a bit short on time so I want to briefly just touch about

some techniques with comb beam CT which are very helpful to us there are a lot of reasons why you should use comb beam CT it gives us the the most extensive anatomic understanding of vascular territories and the implications for

that with oncology are extremely valuable because of things like margin like we discussed here's an example of a patient who had a high AF P and their bloodstream which tells us that they have a cancer in her liver we can't see

it on the CT there but if you do a cone beam CT it stands up quite nicely why because you're giving levels of contrast that if you were to give them through a peripheral IV it would be toxic to the patient but when you're infusing into a

segment the body tolerates at the problem so patient preparation anxa lysis is key you have them exhale above three seconds prior to that there's a lot of change to how we're doing this people who are introducing radial access

power injection anywhere from about 50 to even sometimes thirty to a hundred percent contrast depends on what phase you're imaging we have a Animoto power injector that allows us to slide what contrast concentration we like a lot of

times people just rely on 30% and do their whole the case with that some people do a hundred percent image quality this is what it looks like when someone's breathing this is very difficult to tell if there's complete

lesion enhancement so if you do your comb beam CT know it looks like this this is trying to coach the patient and try to get them to hold still and then this is the patient after coaching which looks like this so you can tell that you

have a missing portion of the lesion and you have to treat into another segment what about when you're doing an angio and you do a cone beam CT NIT looks like this this is what insufficient counts looks like on comb beam so when you see

these sort of Shell station lines that are going all over the screen you have to raise dose usually in larger patients but this is you know you either slow down the acquisition speed of your comb beam or

you raise dose this is what it looks like after we gave it a higher dose protocol it really changes everything those lines are still there but they're much smaller how do you know if you have enhancement or a narrow artifact you can

repeat with non-contrast CT and give the patient glucagon and you can find the small very these small arteries that pick off the left that commonly profuse the stomach the right gastric artery you can use your comb beam CT to find

non-target evaluation even when your angio doesn't suggest it so this is a patient they have recurrent HCC we didn't angio from here those arteries down there where those coils were looked funny even though the patient was

quote-unquote coiled off we did a comb beam CT and that little squiggly C shape structures that duodenum that's contrast going in it this would be probably a lethal event for the patient or certainly would require surgery if you

treated that much with y9t reposition the catheter deeper towards the lesion and you can repeat your comb beam CT and see that you don't have an hands minh sometimes you have these little accessory left gastric artery this is

where we really need your help you know a lot of times everyone's focused and I think the more eyes the better for these kind of things but we're looking for these little tiny vessels that sometimes hop out of the liver and back into the

stomach or up into the esophagus there's a very very small right gastric artery in this picture here this patient post hepatectomy that rides along the inferior surface of the liver it's a little curly cube so and this is a small

esophageal branch so when you do comb beam TT this is what the stomach looks like when it enhances and this is what the esophagus looks like when it enhances you can do non contrast comb beam CTS to confirm ablation so you have

a lesion this is the comb beam CT for enhancement you treat with your embolic and this is a post to determine that you've had completely shin coverage and you can see how that correlates a response so the last thing we're going

thank you Michael thank you to Medtronic for having me and thank you to the AI a your organization for having me today I seem to be having a little trouble advancing my slides so I'm just gonna get started with my introduction here we go

so I'm here's my disclosures basically I am sponsored by Medtronic to provide this Lunch and Learn for you but I am an active clinician I work actively at Yale as a CRNA and I do provide the majority of my anesthesia in what we call our off

floor locations meaning interventional radiology EP lab GI endoscopy r zh' in the operating room so I understand the challenges you face I do you know the sedation in those rooms myself so I understand the positioning concerns the

monitoring concerns and so I'm really I'm honored to be here today and I hope that I add value to your conference while you're having lunch I won't talk about anything that is off-label use everything I will present today is

evidence-based medicine and had been proven I'm not here to sell you any products or talk you into buying anything I just really strictly clinician to clinician so starting out we only have

an hour and I really want to make sure I get through everything today so I'm gonna ask if you have any questions to please hold them to the end and that's for a couple reasons because if you have a question I might even be covering that

material in subsequent slides and I want to make sure I get through the whole presentation the beginning of the talk is going to be some review material for some of you we're gonna move through the first 30 slides pretty quickly because I

understand that the majority of you are already using capnography and I want to spend the majority of our time in this presentation talking about the stuff that the advanced level the problem solving the troubleshooting and the

things that are really pertinent to your practice so that you have value that is gained from attending this presentation today

now other causes this is a little bit different different scenario here but it's not always just as simple as all

there's leaky valves in the gonadal vein that are causing these symptoms this is 38 year old Lafleur extremity swelling presented to our vein clinic has evolved our varicosities once you start to discuss other symptoms she does have

pelvic pain happiness so we're concerned about about pelvic congestion and I'll mention here that if I hear someone with exactly the classic symptoms I won't necessarily get a CT scan or an MRI because again that'll give me secondary

evidence and it won't tell me whether the veins are actually incompetent or not and so you know I have a discussion with the patient and if they are deathly afraid of having a procedure and don't want to have a catheter that goes

through the heart to evaluate veins then we get cross-sectional imaging and we'll look for secondary evidence if we have the secondary evidence then sometimes those patients feel more comfortable going through a procedure some patients

on the other hand will say well if it's not really gonna tell me whether the veins incompetent or not why don't we just do the vena Graham and we'll get the the definite answer whether there's incompetence or not and you'll be able

to treat it at the same time so in this case we did get imaging she wanted to take a look and it was you know shame on me because it's it's a good thing we did because this is not the typical case for pelvic venous congestion what we found

is evidence of mather nur and so mather nur is compression of the left common iliac vein by the right common iliac artery and what that can do is cause back up of pressure you'll see her huge verax here and here for you guys

huge verax in that same spot and so this lady has symptoms of pelvic venous congestion but it's not because of valvular incompetence it's because of venous outflow obstruction so Mather 'nor like I mentioned is compression of

that left common iliac vein from the right common iliac artery as shown here and if you remember on the cartoon slide for pelvic congestion I'm showing a dilated gonna delve a non the left here but in this case we have obstruction of

the common iliac vein that's causing back up of pressure the blood wants to sort of decompress itself or flow elsewhere and so it backed up into the internal iliac veins and are causing her symptoms along with her of all of our

varicosities and just a slide describing everything i just said so i don't think we have to reiterate that the treatments could you go back one on that I think I did skip over that treatments from a thern er really are also endovascular

it's really basically treating that that compression portion and decompressing the the pelvic system and so here's our vena Graham you can see that huge verax down at the bottom and an occluded iliac vein so classic Mather nur but causing

that pelvic varicosity and the pelvic congestion see huge pelvic laterals in pelvic varicosities once we were able to catheterize through and stent you see no more varicosity because it doesn't have to flow that way it flows through the

way that that it was intended through the iliac vein once it's open she came back to clinic a week later significant improvement in symptoms did not treat any of the gonadal veins this was just a venous obstruction causing the increased

pressure and symptoms of pelvic vein congestion how good how good are we at

patients may be asking you is like what about adenomyosis and I've been hearing something about that which is not exactly fibroids right it's a different entity though the symptoms could be kind of the same and for the years and years

and years we wouldn't have any options for patients who had adenomyosis in fact the only option for patients with adenomyosis is surgery but adenomyosis can coexist with fibroids and sometimes patient presents with adenomyosis alone

so we've had some studies now that have looked at that and although the data is not as robust and not as awesome as for patients with fibroids we do provide a performing bolas Asian for those patients with particles that are little

smaller than what we would use for fibroids with results as you're seen there before now the only other new thing that's on the market and it's not so new to you guys that are probably doing radial in femorals anyway working

in cardiac labs and IR labs it's actually what we call the trophy if you go back one slide for me mr. a the person and press play then we will be able to see that radial access I do not work for Merritt they don't give me a

dime I just thought that this was a good video is there volume on that at all if not I can just talk about it and really what it says is that if you need to a radial UFE or have radial axis for a uterine embolization patients just love

it more they and especially like patients that are already just intimidated they don't want you going near their groins at all they actually could just lay on the table we don't have to put up we don't put a Foley in

they just get a radial access the same way that you would just be starting in a line except we have special types of radial catheters and and sheaves to do that and I don't offer a radial access to

patients who are too tall for our catheters or if they've had multiple prior radial access and don't have an intact ulnar artery to complete their hand but it's much like any of that femoral access that you would normally

see they make special hydrophilic sheaths now they're called from this particular company slender technology where the inner diameter of the sheath essentially the sheath is the same like five French on the outside but they have

cored out the inside so it's a bigger diameter so it's a five six so on the outside it's a five but it will take a six French in the inner inner lumen and you know my practice we do more than 80% of all our arterial punctures with a

radial access and everybody here comes dr. Sean Deroche Nia who is the leading author of that paper for SI R and one of my esteemed partners so most patients are able to get up and walk out if you are go from a radial access the access

is actually closed with just a radial band and the complications of having a hematoma or having the patient's bleed out those just all go away but radial axis have their own complications so I'm not here to say that it is not that but

in our practice we found it to be safe and effective our patients want it and it's become like a practice differentiator so if you're working in a practice that don't do radial you EFI's right now you should mention it because

if you're in a population where the other providers are only doing femoral then you will automatically get the patients that only want that so here's a patient that had a radial access you can see a catheter that is coming from the

aorta while you can't see that it's not up and over the bifurcation but maybe you do can see that and there's a catheter in the uterine artery with the characteristic

shape of the uterine artery and the characteristic curlicue vessels of of the fibroid and on the left you can see the Imogen for beforehand and the Imogen on the right of post embolization where there is stagnant flow in the main

uterine not main uterine artery in the horizontal portion of the uterine artery for greater than five cardiac beads and again there's there's no reason that you have to know that level of detail except that you're scrubbing in but if you're

in the audience you're looking at this you're like dr. Newsome I see an air bubble there as well then I'd say good because because I do see it too so you can see the preimage and you can see the post image for pre and post embolization

these these procedures can be quick these procedures are very very rewarding and and I love to do it

higher procedures that get done in the country so they are from being basics such as being para sentences and in some

centers being quite complex in Euro work and there are centers where these none of all those that IR procedures being available so it's a very unequal distribution of provision of IR services and like I mentioned earlier on vascular

surgeons and cardiologists have basically taken over the peripheral vascular work and iogic work and other known neuro speciality such as bid early interventions for example saying that these two surgeons who are in some

remote centers who are doing their own provision as biliary basic interventions there is one neuro surgeon who went and had neuro imaging and then your interventional training who is now hundred percent doing a mural

intervention so as far as procedures go my day can be in diagnostic work and you might be dreaming you doing a paracentesis the next thing you might be doing some some I our basic IR and on the same day you might be doing a set

procedure so quite varied but not available in all centers as one would want as fine stuff goes the technology

Sean I know you have not seen these slides at all you wanted I John can talk about this with his eyes closed so it's

not like there's anything but this is the data that was published from the Jade publishing jvi are from what Sean has written and it's just the current standards relating to what you should be expecting what we tell our patients that

they should expect for outcomes as it relates to uterine artery embolization again I'm not really here to try to point this I know you can google these you can get the information yourself but just to say that all of our procedures

have risk and we need to be clear with our patients about them now I believe that with all of these risks combined the benefits of doing uterine fibroid embolization for most patients is far greater than the risk and that's why I

really do have my practice so these are the benefits right shorter hospital stay and I would say more cost-effective and that is really debatable because gynecologists have become smarter and smarter now they're doing like same-day

hysterectomies if you have a vaginal hysterectomy then maybe a UFE is not as cost-effective because they don't have to do an MRI beforehand and they don't get an MRI afterwards and do all of that anyway and if you look at the long-term

cost of that then maybe having a hysterectomy in some patients could be that but we know for sure that patients are more satisfied when they get a embolization procedure than in my MEC to me not in the beginning run because the

procedure can be very painful that is not the procedure itself is painful but post embolization syndrome which could last anywhere from five to seven days can can be very painful again this is the comparative data that was published

by dr. Spees who is our gold medal winner this year understand a lot a lot of work in this space has allowed us to have this conversation with our gynecology partners but also with our patients as we talked about like when

can you return to work how long are you going to be all for you know am I going to need extra child care or whatever how long would I be in the hospital this information helps us to inform our patients about that then on average

you'll stay in the hospital around you know a day or so and most uterine artery embolization procedures are same-day procedures and interventional radiologists are doing these in freestanding centers as well as other

providers without any issues so we're almost down to the end we know that fibroid embolization is proven to be an effective and durable a procedure for controlling patient symptoms it's minimally invasive and it's outpatient

most patients can go back to some normal activity in one to two weeks it has a low complication rates and some patients mein neatest to surgery and should have surgery so in our practice we send around 1/3 of our patients or so to

surgery and the reason that that is that high is that patients are allowed to come and see myself or dr. de riz Nia from the street they do not have to be referred from their gynecologist and so they're just coming from the street then

you will be referring them to a gynecologist because of some of the things that may not make them a good candidate for embolization such as this

includes an interview of the patient abnormalities of major organ systems like cardiac status do they have a reduced ejection fraction do they have coronary artery disease I want to know

if they have an EF of 10% because if they become hemodynamically unstable and I want to give them fluids I'm not going to bolus a patient with a very low ejection fraction with two liters of fluid you're gonna cause

pulmonary edema and you're going to worsen the situation renal status is huge a lot of our patients are renal e impaired and that can affect the way that they clear the sedation medications that we're giving pulmonary status do

they have COPD asthma or sleep apnea sleep apnea is major in procedural sedation neurologic status do they have a history of seizures endocrine status hyper or hypo metabolism of medications can occur if they have a thyroid

disorder we want to know about adverse experiences with sedation in the past do they have a history of a difficult airway for us at NYU if they have been already been identified as a difficult airway that automatically means we're

doing the procedure with anesthesia current medications potential drug interactions is very important we'll go over that a few slides drug allergies and herbal supplements that they're taking tobacco alcohol or

substance use and frequent or repeated exposure to sedation agents is just going to increase their tolerance of the medications physical exam vital signs auscultation of heart and lungs and then their airway assessment sorry excuse me

do they have any Strider snoring or sleep apnea advanced RA they're gonna have a hard time tilting their neck back if they have cervical spine disease or they have rheumatoid arthritis chromosomal abnormalities like

trisomy 21 patients with Down syndrome can have an enlarged tongue that can impair your ability to manually ventilate them if respiratory depression wants to occur body habitus if they have significant obesity especially of the

head and neck areas and head and neck limited neck extension short neck decreased ornamental distance which is basically just looking at how far back they can tilt their head any neck mass and then again cervical spine disease or

trauma do they have a c-spine collar are they on c-spine precautions that's not a patient we're going to be able to manipulate their airway and then mouth opening we do use Mallampati and I'll review

that in a couple of slides so the AFC classification is a categorization of the patient's physiologic status that can be helpful in predicting operative risk it is recommended by the AFA that if a patient is an Asaf or that that

should prompt an evaluation by an anesthesiologist I will tell you at NYU we will still get procedural sedation to some patients who are in Asaf or but we like to identify it ahead of time because if they have significant

comorbidities that will potentially increase their likely hurt likelihood of having an adverse outcome we then have a lower threshold for activating a rapid response or a code if something was to happen if we got concerned about

something so the airway assessment is

so just a compliment what we everybody's talked about I think a great introduction for diagnosing PID the imaging techniques to evaluate it some of the Loney I want to talk about some of the above knee interventions no disclosures when it sort of jumped into

a little bit there's a 58 year old male who has a focal non-healing where the right heel now interestingly we when he was referred to me he was referred to for me for a woman that they kept emphasizing at the anterior end going

down the medial aspect of the heel so when I literally looked at that that was really a venous stasis wound so he has a mixed wound and everybody was jumping on that wound but his hour till wound was this this right heel rudra category-five

his risk factors again we talked about diabetes being a large one that in tandem with smoking I think are the biggest risk factors that I see most patient patients with wounds having just as we talked about earlier we I started

with a non-invasive you can see on the left side this is the abnormal side the I'm sorry the right leg is the abnormal the left leg is the normal side so you can see the triphasic waveforms the multiphasic waveforms on the left the

monophasic waveforms immediately at the right I don't typically do a lot of cross-sectional imaging I think a lot of information can be obtained just from the non-invasive just from this the first thing going through my head is he

has some sort of inflow disease with it that's iliac or common I'll typically follow within our child duplex to really localize the disease and carry out my treatment I think a quick comment on a little bit of clinicals so these

waveforms will correlate with your your Honourable pencil Doppler so one thing I always emphasize with our staff is when they do do those audible physical exams don't tell me whether there's simply a Doppler waveform or a Doppler pulse I

don't really care if there's not that means their leg would fall off what I care about is if monophasic was at least multiphasic that actually tells me a lot it tells me a lot afterwards if we gain back that multiphase the city but again

looking at this a couple of things I can tell he has disease high on the right says points we can either go PITA we can go antegrade with no contralateral in this case I'll be since he has hide he's used to the right go contralateral to

the left comment come on over so here's the angio I know NGOs are difficult Aaron when there's no background so just for reference I provided some of the anatomy so this is the right you know groin area

right femur so the right common from artery and SFA you have a downward down to the knee so here's the pop so if we look at this he has Multi multi multiple areas of disease I would say that patients that have above knee disease

that have wounds either have to level disease meaning you have iliac and fem-pop or they at least have to have to heal disease typically one level disease will really be clot against again another emphasis a lot of these patients

since they're not very mobile they're not very ambulatory this these patients often come with first a wound or rest pain so is this is a patient was that example anyway so what we see again is the multifocal occlusions asta knows

he's common femoral origin a common femoral artery sfa origin proximal segment we have a occlusion at the distal sfa so about right here past the air-duct iratus plus another occlusion at the mid pop to talk about just again

the tandem disease baloney he also has a posterior tibial occlusion we talked about the fact that angio some concept so even if I treat all of this above I have to go after that posterior tibial to get to that heel wound and complement

the perineal so ways to reach analyze you know the the biggest obstacle here is on to the the occlusions i want to mention some of the devices out there I'm not trying to get in detail but just to make it reader where you know there's

the baiance catheter from atronics essentially like a little metal drill it wobbles and tries to find the path of least resistance to get through the occlusion the cross or device from bard is a device that is essentially or what

I call is a frakking device they're examples they'll take a little peppermint they'll sort of tap away don't roll the hole peppermint so it's like a fracking device essentially it's a water jet

that's pulse hammering and then but but to be honest I think the most effective method is traditional wire work sorry about that there are multiple you know you're probably aware of just CTO wires multi weighted different gramm wires 12

gram 20 gram 30 gram wires I tend to start low and go high so I'll start with the 12 gram uses supporting micro catheter like a cxi micro catheter a trailblazer and a B cross so to look at here the sheath I've placed a sheet that

goes into the SFA I'm attacking the two occlusions first the what I used is the micro catheter about an 1/8 micro catheter when the supporting my catheters started with a trailblazer down into the crossing the first

occlusion here the first NGO just shows up confirmed that I'm still luminal right I want to state luminal once I've crossed that first I've now gone and attacked the second occlusion across that occlusion so once I've cross that

up confirm that I'm luminal and then the second question is what do you want to do with that there's gonna be a lot of discussions on whether you want Stan's direct me that can be hold hold on debate but I think a couple of things we

can agree we're crossing their courageous we're at the pop if we can minimize standing that region that be beneficial so for after ectomy couple of flavors there's the hawk device which

essentially has a little cutter asymmetrical cutter that allows you to actually shave that plaque and collect that plaque out there's also a horrible out there device that from CSI the dime back it's used to sort of really sort of

like a plaque modifier and softened down that plaque art so in this case I've used this the hawk device the hawk has a little bit of a of a bend in the proximal aspect of the catheter that lets you bias the the device to shape

the plaque so here what I've done you there you can see the the the the the teeth itself so you can tell we're lateral muta Liz or right or left is but it's very hard to see did some what's AP and posterior so usually

what I do is I hop left and right I turned the I about 45 degrees and now to hawk AP posterior I'm again just talking left to right so I can always see where the the the the AP ended so I can always tell without the the teeth

are angioplasty and then here once I'm done Joan nice caliber restored flow restored then we attacked the the common for most enosis and sfa stenosis again having that device be able to to an to direct

that device allows me to avoid sensing at the common femoral the the plaque is resolved from the common femoral I then turn it and then attack the the plaque on the lateral aspect again angioplasty restore flow into the common firm on the

proximal SFA so that was the there's the plaque that you can actually obtain from that Hawk so you're physically removing that that plaque so so that's you know that's the the restoration that flow just just you know I did attack the

posterior tibial I can cross that area I use the diamond back for that balloon did open it up second case is a woman

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